I don't think it's Bob Hope. There was a story about him standing up during a Pearl Bailey show to shut up a racist heckler, and he would work with anyone as long as they were talented.
Then again, there are stories about Bob telling really virulent racist jokes offstage. TBH, there was a time years when those were commonly told, and I don't think that really was an indicator of whether someone was a racist.
No way this dude's A-list, and he's much more anti-Semitic than racist, but he was a HUGE influence: Frank Fay. http://blog.wfmu.org/freeform/2014/06/comedys-fascist-sympathizer-by-kliph-nesteroff.html
Holy crap, from that article, I had no idea this happened:
" In January 1946, several months after Germany had been defeated, a rally of ten thousand white supremacists gathered at Madison Square Garden. They delivered speeches in support of Franco, Mussolini and their fallen hero Adolf Hitler. They promised that the defeat of Germany would not go unpunished. The podium was beneath a banner that saluted their guest of honor. The event was called "The Friends of Frank Fay."
North American stand-up comedy has its roots in various traditions of popular entertainment of the late 19th century, including vaudeville, English music hall, burlesque or early variety shows; minstrel shows, humorist monologues by personalities such as Mark Twain, and circus clown antics. With the turn of the century and ubiquitousness of urban and industrial living, the structure, pacing and timing, and material of American humor began to change. Comedians of this era often depended on fast-paced joke delivery, slapstick, outrageous or lewd innuendo, and donned an ethnic persona—African, Scottish, German, Jewish—and built a routine based on popular stereotypes. Jokes were generally broad and material was widely shared, or in some cases, stolen. Industrialized American audiences sought entertainment as a way to escape and confront city living.
The founders of modern American stand-up comedy include Moms Mabley, Jack Benny, Bob Hope, George Burns, Fred Allen, Milton Berle, and Frank Fay all of whom came from vaudeville or the Chitlin' Circuit.[5] They spoke directly to the audience as themselves, in front of the curtain, known as performing "in one". Frank Fay gained acclaim as a "master of ceremonies" at New York's Palace Theater. Vaudevillian Charlie Case (also spelled Charley Case) is often credited with the first form of stand-up comedy; performing humorous monologues without props or costumes. This had not been done before during a vaudeville show.
Nightclubs and resorts became the new breeding ground for stand-ups. Acts such as Alan King, Danny Thomas, Martin and Lewis, Don Rickles, Joan Rivers, and Jack E. Leonard flourished in these new arenas.
Actually, the first recognized stand up comic was an English guy named Julius Tannen who was the first to put the props down and just tell jokes..he was the guy that gives the talking picture demo in Singin in the Rain...I dunno who this is, but Eddie Anderson had only kudos for Jack Benny
He may have been A list when he was first performing. Being a Nazi sympathizer and a wife beater probably diminished his popularity to the point where he was no longer given his due. He made a lot of enemies.
I read most guesses and comments and agree Bob Hope was an asshole and probably in the closet pedo, but I don't think racist. Lewis is a great answer but he was more of a full blown entertainer, so it leaves Burns, Berle, and Allen as the true pioneers of comedy. Young man played and instrument as well and Benny was close to and had wonderful relationship with Rochester.
According to Kliph Nesterhoff's book _The Comedians_, Frank Fay is the founder of American standup comedy, anyway -- as in, he didn't have an "act," he just stood there in a tuxedo and told jokes. And yes, he was a stupendously foul racist. But I doubt this blind intended for him to be the answer -- probably Berle or Hope, but it wasn't as if there was anything interesting or different about their racial attitudes...and at least in Berle's case, there's a story about his insulting Miles Davis's band to their faces back in the 50s. Nobody has ever had anything negative to say about Benny, even in this regard, and actually Nesterhoff's book depicts Benny protesting the cartoonish qualities of Rochester and insisting that the writers make him much less of a Stepin Fetchit type... as after all the point of Benny's show was that the jokes were at his expense, not Rochester's.
Jack Benny?
ReplyDeleteBob Hope(?)
ReplyDeleteI say with much trepidation.
Milton Berle
ReplyDeleteHenny Youngman?
ReplyDeleteBob Hope?
ReplyDeleteGeorge Burns.(Or Milton Berle).
ReplyDeleteMy vote would also be for Benny, but I thought he had a good relationship with Rochester? Idk
ReplyDeleteI don't think it's Bob Hope. There was a story about him standing up during a Pearl Bailey show to shut up a racist heckler, and he would work with anyone as long as they were talented.
ReplyDeleteJohn Wayne
ReplyDeleteThen again, there are stories about Bob telling really virulent racist jokes offstage. TBH, there was a time years when those were commonly told, and I don't think that really was an indicator of whether someone was a racist.
ReplyDeleteHeard some very disgusting things about Bob Hope. Worst things than being racist.
ReplyDeleteBob cheated on his wife for years, but I don't consider that worse than being racist.
ReplyDeleteNo way this dude's A-list, and he's much more anti-Semitic than racist, but he was a HUGE influence: Frank Fay.
ReplyDeletehttp://blog.wfmu.org/freeform/2014/06/comedys-fascist-sympathizer-by-kliph-nesteroff.html
Holy crap, from that article, I had no idea this happened:
ReplyDelete" In January 1946, several months after Germany had been defeated, a rally of ten thousand white supremacists gathered at Madison Square Garden. They delivered speeches in support of Franco, Mussolini and their fallen hero Adolf Hitler. They promised that the defeat of Germany would not go unpunished. The podium was beneath a banner that saluted their guest of honor. The event was called "The Friends of Frank Fay."
Milton Berle?
ReplyDeleteFred Allen or George Burns.
ReplyDeleteNorth American stand-up comedy has its roots in various traditions of popular entertainment of the late 19th century, including vaudeville, English music hall, burlesque or early variety shows; minstrel shows, humorist monologues by personalities such as Mark Twain, and circus clown antics. With the turn of the century and ubiquitousness of urban and industrial living, the structure, pacing and timing, and material of American humor began to change. Comedians of this era often depended on fast-paced joke delivery, slapstick, outrageous or lewd innuendo, and donned an ethnic persona—African, Scottish, German, Jewish—and built a routine based on popular stereotypes. Jokes were generally broad and material was widely shared, or in some cases, stolen. Industrialized American audiences sought entertainment as a way to escape and confront city living.
ReplyDeleteThe founders of modern American stand-up comedy include Moms Mabley, Jack Benny, Bob Hope, George Burns, Fred Allen, Milton Berle, and Frank Fay all of whom came from vaudeville or the Chitlin' Circuit.[5] They spoke directly to the audience as themselves, in front of the curtain, known as performing "in one". Frank Fay gained acclaim as a "master of ceremonies" at New York's Palace Theater. Vaudevillian Charlie Case (also spelled Charley Case) is often credited with the first form of stand-up comedy; performing humorous monologues without props or costumes. This had not been done before during a vaudeville show.
Nightclubs and resorts became the new breeding ground for stand-ups. Acts such as Alan King, Danny Thomas, Martin and Lewis, Don Rickles, Joan Rivers, and Jack E. Leonard flourished in these new arenas.
Actually, the first recognized stand up comic was an English guy named Julius Tannen who was the first to put the props down and just tell jokes..he was the guy that gives the talking picture demo in Singin in the Rain...I dunno who this is, but Eddie Anderson had only kudos for Jack Benny
ReplyDeleteHe may have been A list when he was first performing. Being a Nazi sympathizer and a wife beater probably diminished his popularity to the point where he was no longer given his due. He made a lot of enemies.
ReplyDeleteJohn Wayne was known for being a stand-up comedian?
ReplyDeleteWell, some of his westerns were cringe-funny. ;-)
ReplyDeleteCan we safely eliminate Moms Mabley or no?
ReplyDeleteI actually heard he was a pedophile.
ReplyDeleteJerry Lewis?
ReplyDeleteRichard Pryor?
ReplyDeleteI read most guesses and comments and agree Bob Hope was an asshole and probably in the closet pedo, but I don't think racist. Lewis is a great answer but he was more of a full blown entertainer, so it leaves Burns, Berle, and Allen as the true pioneers of comedy. Young man played and instrument as well and Benny was close to and had wonderful relationship with Rochester.
ReplyDeleteAccording to Kliph Nesterhoff's book _The Comedians_, Frank Fay is the founder of American standup comedy, anyway -- as in, he didn't have an "act," he just stood there in a tuxedo and told jokes. And yes, he was a stupendously foul racist. But I doubt this blind intended for him to be the answer -- probably Berle or Hope, but it wasn't as if there was anything interesting or different about their racial attitudes...and at least in Berle's case, there's a story about his insulting Miles Davis's band to their faces back in the 50s.
ReplyDeleteNobody has ever had anything negative to say about Benny, even in this regard, and actually Nesterhoff's book depicts Benny protesting the cartoonish qualities of Rochester and insisting that the writers make him much less of a Stepin Fetchit type... as after all the point of Benny's show was that the jokes were at his expense, not Rochester's.
Will Rogers
ReplyDelete@ Encino Man- That is a very interesting possibility.
ReplyDeleteMy guess as well.
ReplyDeleteWhat's everyone so outraged about? I'm sure this person was no more racist than Chris Rock who's ass everyone licks.
ReplyDeleteAlan King
ReplyDeleteTed Healy.
ReplyDeleteYea. You wish. Tell the truth, shame the devil.
ReplyDeleteFrank Day.
ReplyDeleteMinor skirmish between Richard Pryor and Milton Berle:
ReplyDeletehttps://youtu.be/SkKdDWstwWE?t=113
Probably better/longer clips around.
[…] August 27, 2016 […]
ReplyDelete