My guess is that deciding whether or not the OD is accidental would rely on both whether or not there was evidence such as a note at the scene, and the amount of opiates in the deceased's system; a truly massive amount would tend to suggest someone who really meant to do it, especially if there are still pills in their stomach that weren't absorbed before they died. (Wasn't this part of what convinced everyone that DJ AM had killed himself rather than accidentally OD'd? IIRC, he'd taken so many so fast that one or more were still in his throat when he died.) Of course, it's possible that a really hardcore addict could have built up one hell of a tolerance, but I'm thinking that might be more likely with heroin than with Oxy, etc.
I loathe Rx. Just loathe it. It's so easy to become addicted and fairly easy to keep yourself in supply.
I was hooked on Percocet/Vicodin and Soma for 8 hellish years. I'm coming up on 5 years off of them in January. I've got some dental work I desperately need done and I'm so nervous about the pain and needing to use something for relief.
@Robin…the tolerance build-up is unbelievable. I was taking minimum 30 pills a day of the Perkies and Soma each. Minumum! I take only Ibuprofen and occasionally Benadryl. I get stoned off of the Benadryl now. I dunno. I really hate Big Pharm.
Rest in peace, Joey.
I think some people get to a point they don't care if they or live or die through the night so they just keep taking pills.
Just sad leaving a child behind, don't bring innocents into this world to mourn you if you don't care if your around to raise them.
He found a permanent solution to temporary problems
Congratulations to you on your sobriety! I was prescribed the 'miracle' pain med OxyContin in 2001, quickly graduated to Heroin because it was cheaper and also was on Soma for 'breakthrough' pain. I also was prescribed benzos. That was a hellacious 5 years! Have been clean since 2006. I don't take anything except for ibu and an occasional.Benadryl. And I had to lol at the mention of getting stoned off Benadryl, because it affects me the same way too!
Rest in peace Joey.
Ic: and, the same to you! Sobriety is wonderful! I don't miss the pills at all. And, it made my MI worse, probably because I was always stressing about getting the next refill.
This is new info, being kinda kicked around and is mostly anecdotal (and I'm no doctor), but imodium/loperamide can be used to kick opiate addiction. It's a narcotic but can't cross the blood/brain barrier; it fills the opiate receptors, stopping withdrawal, but won't render a high. That's why it's sold over the counter with no restrictions.
Once a person finds a dosage that staves off the sick, the amount can be dropped gradually.
It's good and bad, in a way. Bad because someone may think "well, I could quit opiates easily, so why not start doing them?" But that same person, once trapped, could instead of going to that next level when the money runs out (stealing, selling things, or worse) they can get the loperamide and not get so desperate they'd beat up their grandma for a fix.
Like I said, it's highly anecdotal at this point. I found out because I have horrible stomach problems, went through a lot of doctors, strong medicines and misery. The loperamide stopped it all; there was no withdrawal from the strong stuff I was taking. My difference is I'll be taking it for the rest of my life, no weaning off it.
I certainly don't want to make light of misery that addiction brings! I just don't want to see people trapped, becoming desperate, ruining their lives or dying like this guy did. Just, if someone's in that terrible situation, look it up, it's something that could help.
Coming off Vicodin now after 7 weeks due to ankle surgery. Kind of wish I was dead.
Can you hire a killer to kill yourself?
That might creep out even the most hardcore gangsta.
It gets better Brenda!!
I'm ten months clean from a nine year doctor prescribed addiction .. Anyone who's been through this doesn't need me to describe it.. They know what Hell feels like. I'm just now starting to sleep through the night..
Ive lost two good friends in the month alone to this bs called opiates. One of them could have easily been me.
Ic, that's a harrowing story — but I've met more than one person who graduated from synthetic opiate pills to street heroin. It's a hell of a path, and I'm glad you're off it.
@Brenda…it does get better!! It really does. I never in my wildest dreams would have ever thought life could be so great clean and sober. Yeah, the problems are still there…and, you know what? When I get rid of this week's problems…another one will come along eventually. I'm just taking it all in stride and doing just fine. You will be okay, hon! (((hugs))) And, to my fellow/sister sobers….YAY you! <3
I guess I missed some comments here…
Ic…I did heroin for about 6 months and it was freaking crazy how fast I sunk into it. I went back to the pills, 'cause it's…y'know…more respectable. But, I had a helluva time with cravings for years. I'm so glad to hear you're off of it.
Buick. Did you report that bitch? I went to the dentist about 3 years ago and I was adamant that she give me as few pills as possible. Like, only 6 pills. She wrote out a Rx for 30…with a refill! I said, Oh hell no! Rewrite it because I'm not leaving with that kind of 'script in my hand. She did and I took only 4 pills and threw out the others in dirty kitty litter. My friends, who knew what I'd gone through, were pissed I threw them out. Whatever.
Did I mention I loathe Rx? I know so many people who are abusing them, if not addicted. I hate them!
As someone who recently lost a loved one to a drug overdose, I was relieved when the coroner's report came back showing it was an accidental overdose. I don't think I could bear thinking my brother intentionally left his young children fatherless. He'd been clean for over a year, went through some rough times & went back to heroin. My theory is he used the same amount he used before he got clean & his body couldn't handle that amount.
It seems a lot of us have crossed that road from Rx to H. I graduated to smoking H my last year of opiate use. I was depressed after my first rehab I went back to using with in 7 days .. While I was using previously just pills I did it alone and tried to hide it. None of my friends at the time used. After my first rehab I met new friends who introduced me to H. I never injected because I was afraid to OD. As if my method of induction would actually save me. When I got " clean " I went on suboxone then just straight bupenephorine. That drug was just as bad and ten times harder to kick .. To anyone contemplating suboxone .. Please don't do it.. You're just putting off the inevitable .. Becoming completely opiate free hurts and no amount of " harm reduction " will fix that.
Miss X: I am so very sorry for your loss.
It's sad to see so many of *us* here. I know what addiction cost me…health issues, the estrangement from family. Lost my job of 15 years. I literally had to start over. This may sound funny but I'm not sure that's a bad thing. I'm much kinder and gentler now. I don't let the small stuff bother me like I used to.
Congrats to the both of you! I too am a recovering addict. Same story- started with Oxy and moved my way to H. It's a tough and gruesome road to recovery and only those that really want it survive. I went through 3 different inpatient centers before I got clean for myself. Keep fighting the good fight, one day at a time :-).
Careful with that Kava. A body builds tolerance to it. It can wreck havoc on you liver and kidneys if taken in larger servings. I'm not dating you're anything like me- but I have an incredibly addictive personality. I was going through a rough patch in my marriage and started drinking Kava. A week in I was doubling tea bags in one cup of tea. A few months in and my liver enzymes were outrageously high. My Dr. Freaked.
Hi, New poster. I can't believe how easy it is in the U.S to get these drugs. I live in the U.K, and its hard to even get Valium/antibiotics on prescription.I love the community here, and while I think enty is very funny, it's the comments I like to read.Well done to all who have got through what sounds like a very painful experience, and Brenda, good luck, one day at a time x
Have just realised that it's 2.35am in the US, it's 10.35am here… Whoops x
The iodium/loperamide thing is very interesting, Im curious though about an obvious very uncomfortable side effect. I am very late to the game and know Zeeky might not see this.
By the way with the CIA/Government importing pure heroin from Afghanistan, the same way they imported cocaine during the iran/contra affair, everyone's suddenly got free access to tons of cheap pure heroin. Where does it come from and why is it everywhere now? Afghanistan that's where. Every couple of months/weeks I hear about how another friend of a friend overdosed after going back to heroin/opiates from being clean for a while. That's how people die so easily, they get clean, lower their tolerance then use again at the same amount that they did when they were using all the time, then they accidentally overdose.Do you still think the government's got yours and your kids best interests at heart? Please Read "Along Came a Pale Horse" by William Cooper and prepare to have your mind completely and totally blown.
Anotheramy – And now it's my turn being late to this, getting back here! Hope you see this.
The "obvious very uncomfortable side effect" is what brought me to loperamide / imodium. I was extremely sick for DECADES with stomach trouble, and went through all kinds of treatments, medicines, natural remedies, drugs, dietary changes. It was only within the last few years I found out it can be used as a preventative. Not even my doctors knew that, I found the info online. I've since told any doctor I visit that I take it every day, and none have questioned it.
So now, I take a lot. Five in the AM, five more in PM. That just brings me back to normal. If I skip a dose, it's doom.
Now, most people addicted to opiates don't have my problem, but I've found imodium doesn't "clog you up" any more than other opiates. If a person went from using hard opiates daily to imodium, they probably wouldn't find a big change in regularity.
Remember, imodium is a real, true opiate; it just can't get you high.
Because it can't, it makes a better choice than methadone or similar. You're still trading one for another, but you're sober; you can get back to living much faster.