Monday, November 26, 2012

Walmart Workers Kill Man

A man in Georgia yesterday stole two DVD players from a Walmart and left through the front door. Two employees and a security guard chased the man outside and the security guard put the man with the DVD players in a choke hold. When police arrived, the shoplifter was bleeding from his nose and mouth and was unresponsive and pronounced dead. Walmart says it is investigating and did fire the security guard, but is paying the other two employees while it is investigating.

58 comments:

Melinda9 said...

Tragic to kill someone and to die for two shitty dvd players.

seaward said...

Goddamn, it's 2 DVD players. Just let it go, man. I had no idea Walmart security guards took their jobs so seriously.
RIP to the dead guy whose name I don't even know, my thoughts are with his family.

KellyLynn said...

Our Walmart's policy is to not pursue a shoplifter, but to record a description of the incident and call the police. I can't imagine that store's policy would be any different.

I feel sad for everyone involved -- from the family of the person who got killed to the security officer, who was probably too stupid to realize how dangerous a choke hold can be.

ButterKwup said...

The death was an accident. The shoplifting was not.

lc said...

Believe it or not, but Walmart has some of the best security out there. I have seen Walmart security guys beat the crap out of shoplifters, like beat down, kick in the head sort of stuff. I have witnessed 5 incidents in 3 different towns in Washington state. They do use excessive force. I am not condoning shoplifting, but the security people of Walmart are lethal weapons.

Vera L- said...

Butter - I don't even know where to start with your comment. Are we now executing shoplifters? Did he deserve it for breaking the law?

Shoplifting is stupid and wrong, but to kill a man for stealing is unconscionable.

portlandjewel said...

I was thinking the same thing. Thanks for saying something.

portlandjewel said...

That's sounds like something my mother would say... and that is definitely not a compliment.

artemis said...

I'm sorry but beating the shit out of shoplifters is ridiculous. The police are paid to deal with this stuff. I understand that stealing is wrong, but loss prevention/security people don't have carte-blanche to assault shoplifters (unless I guess their lives are at risk).

I'm probably going to be really unpopular for saying this, but the wannabe cops who do security/loss prevention that I've personally known are power-tripping douchebags. I'm sure there's decent ones out there but I haven't known any.

portlandjewel said...

How does that make them the best? You just made a case for them being the worst.

annabella said...

most likely the employees are trained/required to do that by walmart.

and they for sure would have been fired had they let him go.

its tragic, but I lay the blame squarely on walmart and not the employees or security guard. they are most likely not properly trained and didn't appreciate how dangerous putting someone in a choke hold is.

I have an idea - why don't we all boycott walmart, and hope they go away, like the kardashians.

bobbi_1025 said...

When I worked for Walmart years ago, the protocol was to ask the person to come back into the store and take them to the back to wait for police.
The thing was though, you couldn't approach a person until they walked out the door with the goods. A store manager and a friend I went to school with(we were both still in high school and he was a scrawny guy) had to follow 2 women out and they actually tried to run my friend over.
The people above def took it way too far and deserve to be prosecuted and fired.
Having said that, keep in mind that Walmart does inventory once a year and the less loss you have, the bigger bonus the managers get. So they drill into employees that the whole store can get looked down upon or worse if their loss is high. And of course the people who work in loss and prevention get their jobs threatened.
But these people took it too far.

ReesesPeace said...

Thank you to Vera and PortlandJewel...voices oph reason.

I worked as a cashier at a major grocery phor years and years...some oph those security guys get ophoph on the chase and would say things like...I hope they phight cuz I'll phuque 'em up! Ugh. It's one thing to take your job seriously and to do it well...it's quite another to get your thrills phrom beating and kicking people.

portlandjewel said...

DONE!

MrWolf said...

I worked security for a while myself.

Every major retail chain - Walmart, Best Buy, all of them - has a DO NOT PURSUE policy. The reason for this is that if shit goes down and then employee gets killed, the company would be liable for insurance and potential lawsuit money. It's easier to write off two dvd players than to pay off the family of a security guard who gets shot to death in a parking lot trying to arrest a thief.

Alot of people attracted to the security field are basically bullies. High school football players who weren't good enough to get into the college and too dumb to get onto the police force. Or with behavioral issues. There's a layer of 'young security' who are basically students and what not holding the job until they graduate or get something better, but for the guys who are older (30s, 40s) you've got a bunch of dudes without alot of prospects, making a minor amount of money, who buy in all the way to 'groupthink' and 'teamthink' and basically spend the time that they're not on shifts working out and taking jiujutsu classes 'in case shit goes down'.

These people are incompetent baboons who degrade the field. Security is threat assessment, risk management and conflict resolution. If you do your job at all well, you can lock down a location and make it safe without even needing a weapon, let alone needing to chase people into the parking lot to fight them.

Being well trained in violence doesn't make you an effective soldier, security guard or cop. Being well trained in tactics does.

auntliddy said...

Interesting accessment of security workers. At my local mall, the security look like the walking wounded- they middleaged plus, they limp, hv one arm shorter than other, partially deaf- really, walking wounded!!

supapimp said...

Yep. Security guards aren't even police academy rejects, they didn't even pass the application process.

supapimp said...

Well said.

Michael said...

Sorry but I can't get worked up over a shoplifter. Make bad choices like that and sometimes it ends badly.

Farmer Ahn said...

Going to Walmart simply to break shit now, going to open food toys drinks throw some crap down. Screw Walmart and their horrible ways. I love that my taxes helps pay for their poverty stricken employee.

Alicia said...

Wth?! How is that good security? In my city even bouncers need a license to be security and if you use force your ass is going to jail!

Alicia said...

Phuck Walmart ( like that Reeses? Lol )

Butter - sad face!! That's someone's son!

CarmeliteLady said...

I agree with Mr. Wolf and everyone who said that most security guards are stupid bullies that are looking for an opportunity to act like walker texas ranger and take out some "bad guy". Dude you're a security guard, take it easy. This is ridiculous, the store's going to look really bad now that they murdered a shoplifter. someone is dead now because they stole two dvd players, that's wrong and the family should sue the crap out of walmart. The guy is dead.

IDoTheRobot said...

Our Wal-Mart has a do not pursue policy. Matter of fact, if someone walks out the door you are not allowed to talk/yell/go after them. IDK what the deal is with the story above, but not all Wal-Mart's are that way.

It's not about the bonuses, it's about keeping all safe- shoppers and employees both.

JW said...

Before we all pile on, all we know for sure is that the guy committed a crime. We also know the thief is dead but we don't know from what. I have seen people die of a heart attack and then bleed from the nose so it isn't an indication of excessive force. You all seem to think the guy was minding his own business, just peacefully strolling along to stow his stolen DVD players, and then the security jumped him. Did he resist, did he take a swing when they went to talk to him, did he have a weapon we don't know about. In fact, the only criminal we know about for sure is the dead man. The others - the jury should still be out. What I also know for sure is, if the guy had not stolen the players, he would probably still be alive. Just because it was Walmart doesn't make it okay for him to do so. Would you be as bent out of shape if pop from the mom and pop chased down the shoplifter and the same thing happened?

Layna Day said...

Shoplifting is wrong. But does the ends justify the means?

Two DVD players = $80.00 (max)

Lawsuit from family of murdered thief = possible millions

Not even on the same planet in terms of impact.

Amartel said...

Ah, the daily Two Minutes of Hate. Sponsored by Wal-Mart. Half price special today only just for you on hateful stupidity.

What? No special posting about the Wal-Mart security guard that was shot by a shoplifter? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/21/margate-walmart-shooting-gunfire-florida_n_1905239.html No?? What a surprise!

Wal-Mart has a do not pursue policy. But don't let that stop you, special caringfeeling ironic snowflake, from hating Wal-Mart.

Just because.

Lastly, DVD players are not a life necessity so no whining if you croak in mid thievery. No, you are not Oliver Twist and no you may not have another. Here's a brilliant thought: maybe try not stealing other peoples' stuff.

Or at least be in fighting shape if you must be a thief.

ReesesPeace said...

I can't and won't speak phor anyone else, but phor me, it's a *human thing*. It's called empathy.

JW said...

Amartel, how I wish this site had the capacity to give a "Thumbs Up".
Love it.

Michael said...

Thumbs up Armatel!

Layna Day said...

So possibly playing a part in someone's death over a DVD player is OK? Because they're a rotten thief who had the nerve to take two?

OK.

nessa said...

Uh, maybe you guys read this comment in the wrong tone. I understand what you're saying, Ic

nessa said...

Sorry, i completely agree with you ButterKwup. All of this could've been avoided

Amartel said...

Layna Day,
Reading comprehension is really not your strong suit. Nor is empathy 'cause your kind of empathy is selective and consequence-free. The poor, dead thief. How the PHuck do you know he's poor and worthy of sympathy?
You're just assuming because it's easy and consequence free to rain down on Wal-Mart. Which, BTW, has a do not pursue policy but this shithead thief died on their property so, uh, they're bad.

You are, however, super great at straw man argumentation (mischaracterizing what someone else has said and then bravely attacking the mischaracterization).

What a profile in caringfeeling courage you are!

Question: if the thief had a heart attack or a stroke running from the Wal-Mart security guards, does that implicate the Wal-Mart security guards in his death?

If a Wal-Mart employee sees someone making off with two DVD players should they simply say "stop or I'll say stop again"?

If the thief is observed toting a 60" plasma out of the store without paying for it, should Wal-Mart provide cart service? At least to the street? Help them load it in their van?

Seriously, if Wal-Mart anticipates this sort of activity and makes no effort to stop it themselves then shouldn't they be liable for the inevitable health crises that ensue when fat moochers take more stuff than they can safely carry?

Does the thief get off from criticism just because he conveniently was not quite up to the task of running from the mall cops?

Question: if you have possibly played a role in someone's death, does it not follow that you have possibly NOT played a role in someone's death?
Question: if you have possibly NOT played a role in someone's death, should you be subjected to internet hatred from Layna Day?

Apparently that's OK.

jax said...

^butt hurt

jax said...

just like Zimmerman, these guards decided to pursue on their own, MOST retail conglomerates like Walmart have a Do Not Pursue policy.

Had they not pursued, this man would be alive, "dirty worthless thief" or not. Instead a man is dead over substandard, soon to be obsolete, electronics.

Dude is getting sued sooo hard.

lc said...

Thanks Nessa, no I was not saying they are the 'best' as in best, but over diligent, power going to their head, stop at nothing to get the perp type of best. They take their loss prevention jobs very seriously!

Upside Downunder said...

The shoplifter probably worked at another Walmart and couldn't afford Christmas presents.

JW said...

If he had not stolen the substandard electronics, dude would still be alive. What part of this are you missing? And again, you have no idea what caused this guy's death except for his own actions.

Amartel, another thumbs up.

JW said...

But, please, if y'all are such fans of the Do Not Pursue policy and just letting thieves walk away, please tell me where you live. I'll be over. Leave a light on.

.robert said...

When did this site ever have a thumbs up option?

Ingrid Superstar said...

I've got a Thumb Up my butthole right now!

mynerva said...

Jesus H Christ. At times like this I'm very glad that I live where I do.

jax said...

JW_ and what fucking part are you missing where people are put to death for stealing in the US??

Why do you think they have Do Not Pursue Policies? I worked in retail for 10 years, in management and with loss prevention- THIS never should have happened. NEVER.

I don't care if the fucking stole a bag of money, that is not procedure. And Walmart firing the security so quickly shows that they agree. Never should have happened over items that are covered by insurance.

And YES- I am a fan of DNP policies.

You know why? How would YOU like to be the guy chasing armed crackheads through a parking lot? DNP normally saves lives if followed accordingly.

You're right we don't know how this guy died, we also don't know if he was stealing the dvd players to sell and feed him family.

works both ways.

The said...

(chuckle) Sounds like Darwin at work to me. You're either a parasite or a producer -- can't be both.

JW said...

Jax - oh, cue the score from Les Miz, waawaawaa.
So, in this great nation of Obama, there are no food stamps, missions, food banks? It's acceptable to steal? Tell that to the liquor store owner or the corner grocer who is working his ass off so some jackass can clean him out. Or, wait, is it only acceptable to steal from Walmart?
The point is, you don't know what killed him and you don't know the circumstances but everyone is so quick to jump to the conclusion that Walmart "killed" him. Here's the obvious conclusion, Don't steal and bad things won't happen to you.

JW said...

Oh, and if he really needed food for his family, why didn't he steal FOOD!?

LeahJane said...

Do you think he was stealing the DVD players to use them himself, or give as Christmas presents? No, more likely he was stealing them to sell on the streets for drugs. Like most of you said, they only cost $40 a piece, and I'm pretty sure Wal-Mart has layayway.

You accept certain risks if you live the thug life. But the thief is getting the majority of the sympathy, while the guy doing his job (because I don't assume he went off to work that morning hoping he would get to kill someone) is villified. Sad.

Tuxedo Cat said...

Holy Shit!! Just because the security guards are not to pursue thieves does not mean:

- that it is all right to steal
- that the police aren't called
- that the police won't catch the criminals

Some posters are making it sound as if the thieves are just getting away with it!!

Amy in MI said...

They never steal food. They steal liquor and baby formula to sell

Where I worked we had the " follow at a safe distance" rule. Get the plate and direction of travel. The police dept I worked with usually caught them

I got in restraints when I didn't feel that my life was in danger. If it was I disengaged.

And many loss prevention officers are educated. I made decent money doing it while I was working on my 2nd bachelors degree

feraltart said...

I will admit to my empathy button for thieves being in the off position. Every person I have spoken to who says they have no money drinks, smokes, or gambles, or does all 3. They always have at least one pet. It is sad that a person died, but it is also something the employee has to live with. I am not dismissing human life, but I agree with the posters who stated that if the person did not steal, they would most likely still be alive. I also doubt they were stealing to sell for food. I worked in a church office, these guys came in looking for money for food, I said we didn't have money but they could have my apples, they declined. I am very sorry for the collateral damage, both of these men's families will have a terrible Christmas.

portlandjewel said...

Phuque em!!! Why do so many of these people think this is okay. You shoplift, you get arrested... Go to court... Maybe do some jail time... No one should be dying behind this. I guess we'll see what really happened in time but this is manslaughter. Depraved indifference to human life!!

Layna Day said...

Dear Amartel,

At what point did I say shoplifting was right? If reading comprehension is a problem for me, then gross assumption is yours.

I have not read one statement in this thread that suggests anyone condones theft. What you and several others are failing to see is that the Do Not Pursue law is more for protecting employees than the thieves. What if the man had a gun and shot down the employees and security guard?

Besides, Wal-Mart has security cameras in the store and surrounding the parking lot. There's at least some chance that the guy would have been caught.

The bottom line is that NO ONE should die over a DVD player. You shouldn't steal one, but you shouldn't die if you do.

Having some common sense isn't the same as empathy. The fact that some of you don't understand that is what's sad about this thread.

JW said...

You can spin this any way you want but your suggestion that this thread has been all about how the DNP is for the protection of the employees is absolute hooey. It's been about lets spit on Walmart and security guards. Read the headline - Walmart Employees Read Man.
Not one poster said, oh, the Walmart employees should not have taken the risk. They all, as one poster put it, vilified Walmart and the Walmart employees for what they perceived as the horrendous action of the employees in "killing" this guy. And as I originally pointed out, the problem with this thread is that the posters all piled on when they don't even know what killed the guy or the circumstances - maybe he did have a weapon and this is justifiable force.

Chismosa Street said...

Thank goodness Winona Ryder chose Saks.

elspeth said...

Yeah, we don't know why the shoplifter died -- Was it caused by the choke hold or because of some physical/medical emergency of the individual?

BUT the Supremes ruled a long time ago in a case involving a couple of on-duty New Orleans policemen who fatally shot a kid during a foot chase following the kid's shoplifting some stuff from a Five & Dime.

They ruled that law enforcement officers can not impose a harsher sentence than a jury would impose if the accused person were brought to trial.

In other words, if the policemen had caught the kid, if he'd gone to trial and been found guilty, the penalty could not and would not have been the death penalty.

Hence, the police could not arbitrarily, at their own discretion in the heat of the moment/chase, pass down a judgment far more serious than a jury would if it had the time to determine the perpetrator's guilt or innocence.

So there's more to come out about this, but property crimes don't merit a death penalty. If in fact the WalMart employees or contractual agent caused the death.

Layna Day said...

And you can spin it all the ways you want, JW. It's clear that you and others SEEM comfortable with someone possibly dying over what ultimately is a petty crime. If that's how you feel, fine. If you don't, pardon my take on the matter. But don't get in a twist when you meet resistance to that dog-eat-dog mentality.

The argument can and probably will be made that since the man died in the security guard's custody, after said guard put the man in a choke hold, that the guard in part contributed to the death. Maybe the man had a condition. Who knows. But we wouldn't be having this conversation if the guard hadn't choke the guy.

Again, I haven't read where one person agreed with theft. No one is holding up the guy as a hero. But he's dead. If you don't empathize or think he had it coming, fine. Some of us see it differently. And political views and misguided priorities have nothing to do with it.

T. E. Cuz said...

i know i'm late on this...

amartel and jw, likes for all your posts.