Saturday, December 15, 2012

Sandy Hook Killings

I don't think I am up for talking about this yet. I, like probably many of you stared numb at a television screen yesterday. No one really did any work. How can you when all you keep asking yourself is how someone could do that to a bunch of innocent children. I think that is what gets everyone inside their hearts and souls so deeply. They think about their own kids or their nieces or nephews and think about what they were like or are like in elementary school and imagined them killed in cold blood. They imagine them hiding in corners of classrooms and the teachers who would probably do anything to keep them safe. It is impossible not to be affected by it. I guess I am talking about it, but, this is emotional talking. I know that when I Tweeted and Facebooked it yesterday, that it was good for a lot of people to discuss. When something like this happens, it makes you realize how trivial gossip is, but at the same time, I know that I took a few minutes to escape yesterday reading some gossip and try and take a breather from the intensity of the situation and the coverage. Big bacon hugs to all the families.

138 comments:

Gypsy said...

Thanks. Those are nice and thoughtful words. Wishing everyone peace, eventually.

Redd said...

Well said, Enty. Just unimaginable horror.

Salsa Lover said...

Thank you. It's hard to talk about... Read about... I won't watch the news. <3 to all.

Maja. With a J. said...

I still don't really know what to say. To call it "a horrifying tragedy" doesn't seem enough. All those parents and families waking up today only to be reminded that their little ones are gone...so, so sad. I also with them peace, eventually.

Maja. With a J. said...

*wish

Kloie said...

Thanks, Enty. I hate how many people have tried to make this whole thing all about *them*, rather than the victims of this awful tragedy. Appreciate that you didn't do that.

MISCH said...

We are still numb....
It is time for us, this country to do something about the growing number of mentally ill people who are dangers to themselves and others...
And yes guns, there is no need for any individual to have an automatic weapon in their home...just crazy.

Alma said...

Prayers with the families of all those lost yesterday.

Shay said...

I'm praying for all the families affected in this tragedy. Those poor little angels.

me said...

Too sad to even begin to comprehend

Mother Campfire said...

That's what I keep thinking about too. :(

Under the Big Skyy said...

There are no words...

Robert said...

One of the most awful things about this entire episode is how close to Christmas it is, and how excited those families must have been in anticipation of a kid's favorite day of the year. Unfathomable. Bless the victims and those who died trying to save them.

Cheryl said...

I am a substitute teacher and I found out about it while I was in a classroom full of little kids in my care. The whole staff wondered what we would do if it happened at our school, right then. We often have "shelter in place" drills at our school, where we lock the doors and keep the children silent while sending sending a note under the door to indicate if all of the kids are accounted for. These drills scare me every time.

Stacey Charter said...

Well said, Big Guy. I did the same thing once I got home last night. Watched my Silver Fox Anderson @ 8 and 10 then HLN in between times. I want to go there and hug these poor people... so much loss.

Tuxedo Cat said...

Condolences from up in Ontario, Canada. When children especially are involved, no matter how often this has happened or will happen it is still as shocking as the first time.
A nation is never the same after a tragedy such as this.

katsm0711 said...

Today the numb confused shock is turning into reality and the sadness is hitting me. Reading about Vicki Soto who died shielding her students from gunfire made me realize it's not a movie. And then Lauren Rousseau who just landed a permanent job at the school and her mom was quoted saying "it was the best year of her life". Yesterday neighbors on tv saying they would see a cop car parked in front of a house and they knew what that meant for the child who had lived there. 20 little, tiny, silly, picky-eater, shy, good spellers, loved art class, always forgot his homework, finallt just got the pet he begged his parents for, helped mom and dad do yard work but really just looked for cool bugs, always forgot to bring a pencil to class, loved anything pink, wanted to be a doctor just like mommie when she grew up, idolized her older brother, helped mommie bake Xmas cookies, wanted the Nintendo DS Hello Kitty game for Xmas, cried when sitting on Santas lap but after laughed with mommie saying it wasn't that scary, would never eat his veggies, couldn't wait to get her nails done with mommie, had a bowling birthday party, or even better, wanted their birthday party at the Edmond Town Hall Movie Theater, . Little tiny happy kids.

surfer said...

One thing that I couldn't stop thinking about was all those parents who were brought to the fire station to meet up with their kids.

Can you imagine the pit in the stomach of the parents whose kids didn't show up? Just thinking about them and what must have been going through their minds is unfathomable.

SusanB said...

It's time we take away the stigma of mental illness and start screening kids in elementary school for problems. It's also time for parents to keep their heads in the sand rather that admit their kid might have a problem. I'm not saying that's what happened in this case, but too many parents insist their darling child could never have done (insert crime here) and deny deny deny. In these cases it's not about helping the kid, it's about keeping the parent's image clean. The most unselfish loving thing you can do for your child is to get them the mental health help they need, not take it as a personal reflection.

audrey said...

The parents of those children and the families of the teachers who were killed will forever be broken. Time may heal the pain but it can never mend a hole in the family. Every year instead of visions of sugar plums and holiday glee, they will have a grim reminder that their loved ones were gunned down in a place where they should have been safe. I can't imagine the horror, the grief, the intense sadness, the guilt they are experiencing. Stop shoving microphones into survivors' faces and let them begin a journey all of us are intensely grateful we don't have to take ourselves.

Land Manatee said...

(I am not on social networks, so I would appreciate everyone's assistance with my plea.)

I would like to get a message to the right ears about demolishing the school after the investigation is complete and erecting in its place a memorial to the innocent and brave souls that were so cowardly and horrifically taken from this earth yesterday.

I cannot imagine the community that is directly affected by this senseless tragedy, conducting business as usual in the school building ever again after what has occurred there.

I am thinking a memorial park, reflection pond, sculptural representation in remembrance of the victims or something similar.

A new school can be rebuilt in another location within the district.

As a parent, at this moment, my heart aches and is angered with this painful and heinous massacre.

"Come to the edge."
"We can't. We are afraid."
"Come to the edge."
"We can't. We will fall."
And they came.
And He pushed them.
And they flew.

seaward said...

@Robert Exactly my thoughts. The holidays are going to be tainted forever for all these families. Unfathomable.
I don't pray, but I will say a prayer for these families and victims.

Jemtastic said...

@katsm0711: Your description of the 20 kids...too real.

@surfer: You're so right. To have a child taken in such a way is one thing but to find out that the way some of these parents did? Almost like a round of musical chairs? How soul crushing.

Diana G said...

I cried pretty much all day yesterday and had trouble sleeping last night. I still cannot believe this happened. I can't stop thinking about all the innocent children that lost their lives and the faculty members. It breaks my heart.

katsm0711 said...

@land there is discussion about demolishing it. I'm leaning towards that myself but I hope no major decision is made until those in charge have somewhat clear heads. Dr Petit demolished his home in Chesire CT and its now a community garden. Actually, maybe a park for kids to play would be a good idea. But don't worry, a man who works at Sandy Hill mentioned on the radio that they want to demolish it.

smash said...

This has broken my heart today. To think of parents who started their week out so normal. And for it to go so bad. Now they are going into their first weekend without their babies. Rest in peace sweet souls.

Diana G said...

So horrific - it was a nightmare watching the news on tv - I can't even imagine what the families of the victims are going through.

JSierra said...

Like I said yesterday, I don't believe in God or Heaven but the only thing I can think about is those sweet children all walking together and being swept into the warm, safe arms of the angels while God kisses the tops of their soft heads. I imagine their small handed waves, flapping excitedly through the air as they say "See you soon" to their families waiting down below. I imagine them crying and angels kissing away the tears before they can fall from their cheeks. I imagine them happy, safe, and free from the fear that gripped them in their last moments on this Earth.

E Gee Be said...

Kats, you just made me cry again...I run youth programs and yesterday's events are just devastating when you think of those little individuals, the teachers, their parents and all of their families. President Obama's speech when he talked about the milestones that would never happen for these babies just broke my heart.

Mrswife29 said...

I was glued to the coverage yesterday. I saw the reporter on CNN say that the shooter's mom was the kindergarten teacher and I just lost it. The reporter had to regain her composure. The whole thing is a nightmare.

MISCH said...

@SusanB

My neighbor's after years of trying finally adopted a child ...because they were older at this point they were not able to get an infant, the child who was and is truly beautiful had deep emotional problems that started developing a few years after her adoption....
Lucky for them they had the open mindedness to see the problem and were in a financial position to get her the help she needs (she attends a special boarding school) the difference in this child is amazing and it looks like she's on the way to a happy and productive life...
There should be no stigma attached to getting the child you love help...not to do so is a complete failure as a parent.

katsm0711 said...

That was so sweet @js. I don't care if something thinks I'm dumb for having faith, I'd much rather imagine my loved ones in a place like heaven, still doing all their favorite things. Your words were really kind especially since you said you don't believe in God or Heaven. I dont care if there's proof or not, I need to believe it.

Cheryl said...

I agree about demolishing the school. That community will never be the same. My husband is stationed at Fort Hood and we got here a few months after the shooting. I live on post and everyone is still haunted by it. The shooting is not discussed or mentioned by name. People will refer to the date, or say "it" as in, "I was here when it happened," and only in hushed tones. There hasn't been much healing in my opinion.

Thank you Ent for giving us a safe place to process this.

penelope said...

I am a US Citizen living in Canada, and work as an EA in a K-12 school. I have no birth children, but have stepchildren of various ages.

Children as young as the victims of this tragedy are so pure, innocent and trusting. When you work at a school they bond to you so quickly. I have lunch/recess duty on the playground and work with K to 5th graders, and when they get hurt they come to you with open arms looking for comfort and a hug -- even the ones who sometimes are mean to their classmates.

I cannot imagine the horror they must have felt watching their teacher and classmates shot, one by one around them. It is a sick person who would do such a thing to children so young. And like many of you, I can only imagine what thoughts are going through their parents heads are they try to wrap their brains around what happened to their children in the last horrific moments of their too-short lives. It is a nightmare come true for all of us who cherish life. My thoughts and prayers are with the entire school and all of the victims -- alive and deceased.

kelgela2 said...

I was looking at my Facebook yesterday at the same time I was watching the news on Univision.

It sickened me to watch that news channel and plenty of people already on their political agenda. I don't care about your stupid opinions on gun law, nor do I care about the experts' opinions on them. I care about the children that died and teachers that died trying to save them.

Seeing the president visibly hold back tears had me trying to mine back. My brother just got out for winter break from college and we are starting back up in January. My thought immediately went to him and the two girls I have known since their birth.

I couldn't sleep until I saw the go up this morning and right now, I am taking a nap before going back to help my mom out at her restaurant. Cherish the moments you have with your loved ones, even if you hate cleaning tables and washing dishes.

SusanB said...

@Misch - 45 or so years ago my dad coached my brothers Little League team for 4 years. At the end of the season he would have a cookout for the kids and their dads. About 20 years ago, one of those kids was arrested when a friend visited his house and found some ears in a fruit bowl on the kitchen table - he left and called the police who found 2 heads in the freezer - he had chopped up his ex and her new boyfriend and scattered the bodies. My brother said he heard rumors when they were kids that this kid had been torturing animals, but outside of baseball, my brother never saw the kid so he didn't know for sure. Who knows if one of the kids who knew had told an adult and the adult had done something, the two dead people would be alive today. Your friends sound like good people who deserve as many kids as they want. Too bad they can't teach the many idiot parents out there.

I just remember how freaked out my dad was when he heard about the murders "But he was in our house!" - he couldn't get over it. And he felt horrible for the dad.

911 girl said...

Such beautiful comments on here...i am drying my eyes as i type..prayers for the families of thone that lost their lives and for the first responds that did their best to prevent further tragedy...also as a former 911dispatcher my prayers and hope for peace for the ones that answered the 911 calls by all...that is the stuff that sticks with you forever. You all did the best job you could..keep your heads up knowing that you did your best in a horrible situation.

feraltart said...

As I wrote yesterday, my thoughts are with the victims, their families and friends. Also with America, I know you are more than these tragedies.
katsm, what you wrote was absolutely beautiful.
I am glad they are discussing turning the site of this tragedy into something beautiful & allowing the chance to heal by building a new school that will not carry the memories.

lc said...

The first thought of mine was to run up to my daughters school. But I did not want to disrupt their day. But you had better believe I was at the school bus stop at the end of the day and hugged her until her eyes bugged out. There was a lot of that going on here in Seattle.

Tuxedo Cat said...

Someday far in the future, I think they will be able to recognize mental illness and treat it like they do other illnesses. I hope your local governments will take the opportunity to help schools out that can't afford up to date security systems.

Until then they need to test children yearly from K to 12. Just standard psychological tests that can weed out children who are becoming sociopathic and who have rage disorders. They need to do this across the board. If the parents don't agree to testing, no school for that child. No testing, no teaching.

They also need to have free help for children who need it. I know you guys pay for everything down there, which is ridiculous. Most people don't have extra money for a shrink.

Schools that can't afford security should be helped immediately by the government. Make metal detectors mandatory, not ones that will go off with every compass, but that are meant to detect firearms. There will be some parents that don't want them, but there will always be that type of overprotective person. Kids are not stupid, they will know what it is for and it will make them feel protected.

Guns should be registered. I realize that criminals are not going to register their guns, but I just mean that make it as difficult as possible to purchase one. Before a gun can be purchased the person must have a clean bill of mental health for a five years.

People that have kids with problems need to keep their guns stored at an armoury until things settle down, or just get rid of them.

I do have guns at home, 22s and some old family heirloom type guns, but they are stored in individual cases with locks that can't be cut with normal boltcutters. My oldest boy has Airsoft guns that can do alot of damage in the right situation. He was bullied at school a few years ago and was suicidal for a couple of months. I took his guns (he was pissed off of course) when he was out, and took them to a storage area that I rent for extra crap from my parents estate that I still have to deal with. I told him he could have them back when he was feeling better. He internalizes anger, he doesn't blame others. He has them back now, but they are in my room locked up, so he has to ask for them. My other boys aren't interested but even the Airsoft guns are always locked up. Sorry about blabbing on about myself, but I was just trying to let you know what goes through the mind of a parent with a troubled child.

Harvey Manfrenjensen said...

I agree with everyone's sentiments, this is such senseless meaningless loss. We need to screen children and teenagers for mental health problems at the school level, for their own and everyone's safety. This has GOT to stop, NOW. And teachers need to be trained to deal with a possible problem kid. There are signs to look for, there are resources in the forms of counseling/professional help at the schools that are paid for and going unused. This should have been caught. It could have been caught. He killed his mother for goodness sakes, and he just went unnoticed throughout his whole life? We as a society need to be more aware of other people's mental and emotional states, in order to prevent this kind of thing from happening. It's truly not that difficult. Someone should have reached out to him, he should have been caught.
There needs to be an awareness campaign about mental and emotional health and for everyone to be on the lookout for warning signs of a friend, classmate, student that could be a danger to themselves or others.

AuntJess said...

This is just madness. My heart and thoughts are with everyone in Newtown To quote my favorite show, The streets of heaven are too crowded with angels tonight. I don't think we can ever really know why someone commits these atrocious acts. Some people just want to destroy everything I'm their path.

AuntJess said...

And please stop interviewing these kids on tv!

car54 said...

I have been sick since the news of this broke. I didn't sleep much last night.

I think the president looked 20 years older yesterday. I want him to fix this but I honestly don't know what to ask him to do. This is just too much--it has happened too many times. We all need to open ourselves to changing ANYTHING that would contribute to preventing this happening again. More screening and training for detecting mental illness, gun control, I don't know what else--but this is just too much. We have to stop immediately falling back on the old political arguments that I saw people doing yesterday--and do something...anything...differently...to help stop this sort of event.

I was in CT 2 weeks ago for business, and after a while yesterday, I realized I had stayed near this school--had driven up and down the road leading to it several times while I was there. It is a small family place---and it's marked forever by this.

dia papaya said...

Robert. That's all I've been thinking about too. The decorated tree and unopened presents. My hearts breaks for them and all they have lost. I just want to hug their pain away but I know I can't.

Praying for every family in that community bc they have all lost. I wish them strength as they move forward. Lots of love to you Newtown, CT. Sending Angels O:-)

Tuxedo Cat said...

One thing they can do immediately is put metal detectors in the doors of schools and install bulletproof barriers over the windows. Keep the doors and windows locked at all times. Ask for parent volunteers to monitor the school yard at all times. Ask the city to hire armed security guards.

If there had been a working metal detector at the entrance with a locked door in front of it this would not have happened.

I know it sounds like Fort Knox, but that is what the schools will have to do from now on.

LottaColada said...

The fact that the principal turned on the loudspeaker to warn the others was probably her final act of heroism. Without that warning, I believe there would of been a lot more deaths. Everyone started barricading themselves in their rooms.

I can't imagine the tremendous pain that everyone is going through. Just no logical explanation for this at all will ever come out.

GladysKravitz said...

I felt like there was something wrong with me last night. I couldn't sleep until after 4 am. I just kept thinking of those poor terrified children who died, their parents, the children and families who lived and their damage, and even the shooter's family and their shame and grief. The adults who died, the town, the poor first responders. Anyway, thank you for sharing that you had trouble sleeping. It makes me feel less alone.

auntliddy said...

Beautifully written.

AuntJess said...

@Tuxedo I believe he broke a window or something to get in. No one let this monster in the front door. All doors were locked. As I understand they recently installed a new security system. It seems to me officials did everything they could in terms of safety.

VIPblonde said...

I apologize in advance, this may be mildly offensive.

My Facebook feed is blowing up with people posting that "guns don't kill people, people kill people." Um, I'm pretty sure guns killed a lot of people yesterday.

My favorite area to study in sociology was overlapping rights, and whose rights take precedence (for example, smoker's rights vs. the right of people who don't smoke to not inhale secondhand smoke, hence all of the smoke-free zones). I'm sorry, but my right to not get shot and the rights of kids to go to school without getting massacred by gunfire should take precedence over your right to carry a gun "for funsies."

LA Mac said...

@katsm0711 this made me cry

LA Mac said...

@katsm0711 this made me cry

NapAssasin said...

I have never truly been affected by a tradgedy so deeply than yesterday's senseless act. I can't stop crying or thinking about those beautiful children having to be identified by their parents. Oh my god, to never hold your baby again, to know they died in such fear, and that you couldn't help them. My soul just screams for the parents who are suffering so needlessly. It is truly evil. And unforgivable. I have no opinion on gun laws, mental illness or all of the things that should have happened to prevent this. But I love my son, and my heart breaks a million times for these families. I'm preparing to visit with lots of friends to celebrate the holidays and it feels hollow, empty in light of yesterday's horror. I pray with all my heart these families find heavenly peace.

timebob said...

I have a weird connection to this story. Ryan Lanza works for the same accounting firm as me. He works on the 18th floor and before cops realized his brother was the shooter they swarmed the floor he worked on. He works on the 18th floor and I work on the 15th floor. Needless to say we were all freaking out about it. What if his brother had decided to kill Ryan and come to our place of work instead? Honestly, I wish he had, I would of taken a bullet over children. Horrific.

I don't know him and never met him, but I can't imagine seeing him in our office. How can you come back to work after what a family member did. Prayers for him and all the others affected by this tragedy.

Nutty_Flavor said...

This guy - will not say the jerk's name - was apparently under a psychiatrist's care, as was the creep from Aurora, and one of the Columbine kids, and the Virginia Tech guy (although the Virginia Tech guy was apparently being seen by some kind of religious healer). Somebody knew that these guys were not entirely right in the head, yet under the system we have created, they continued walking around and went on to commit horrible crimes.

Over the past 30 years, we've done a lot to "deinstitutionalize" mental illness and put severely mentally ill people back into the community, assuming their problems can be controlled by psychotropic drugs. Maybe we need to re-examine that.

Nutty_Flavor said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Christopher Cruz said...

Despite my big mouth, I have no words.

:(

LottaColada said...

@timebob - That is a very strange connection. I read somewhere he noticed his name all over the news when he was falsely ID'd and left work abruptly. To think you are going about your day and a family member of yours goes on a killing spree... No words. Do any of your co-workers know him?

Tuxedo Cat said...

@AuntJess

The sneaky little bastard. He was probably so famililar with the school , maybe he had gone there, and bc his mother taught there. Schools will need to install shatterproof coverings (riveted on not screwed on) over the windows.

Nutty_Flavor said...

@VIPBlonde, I think we agree about the area of overlapping rights, and I don't think there's any reason automatic weapons need to be owned by anyone outside of the law enforcement and military communities, although I have no problems with rifles used for hunting.

I would like to add, however, that a lunatic in China killed 20 schoolchildren with a knife yesterday, and that suicide bombings occur several times a month in southern Iraq. People do, indeed, kill people.

auntliddy said...

I would happily contribute to whatever the familes wish to be built on the site of the former school, and whatever sort of new school they wish to build. In fact its a wonderful way we can all contribute to help soothe the grieving. I too watched about 8 hours of coverage, watched dead go from 3 to 26, cried. But then i had to turn it off and numb my mind a bit. But these poor families cannot do that. I have such empathy for them- i think we all do. I can only wish the peace snd acceptance- someday.

car54 said...

Metal detectors would not have done anything but give a few more seconds warning--he shot through the glass in the locked door and let himself in--went right to the first classroom and with great precision, started shooting. It happened too fast. He didn't get in normally he used his gun to shoot his way in.

What a nightmare for the shooters family as well--we don't think about them in all this--the shooter carried his brother's ID--that's why his name was all over for a while. That poor guy was hauled in to the police station in handcuffs. He must have been scared to death.
I think a lot more will come about about his family.

Another shooting this morning in Alabama:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/15/alabama-hospital-shooting-wounded-gunman-killed_n_2307505.html

dia papaya said...

Thanks for sharing timebob! I can't imagine either :(

HisMom said...

I have to admit I'm disgusted with the media coverage of it. There are some great reporters (Soledad Obrien I am looking at you) but the mix up over identifying the right shooter, (imagine that poor guy who didn't even know yet about his mom and brother's role in all of this) and interviewing children who are not realizing they are saying they heard their classmates murdered....Dear Media: Stop trying to be first, to be best in ratings. Be right. Be respectful. STOP SPECULATION! Just one of you be different from the rest. Have standards.

Getting off my soap box now.

timebob said...

@Lotta no, we were trying to figure out if anyone did but no one knew him in our group.

Ryan works in a seperate group he is a senior/staff person. And his dad used to be a Partner at the firm, but is now with GE capital. I gues that is how Ryan got his job through his dad.

dia papaya said...

SusanB - ITA. Mental illness is the last acceptable health care stigma. I am overgeneralizing but after the events of this year, how can we come to any other conclusion? Start doing assessments as early as possible and get appropriate therapy. Force the insurance companies to pay for services!!!

We have created lots of self-entitled little boy men with underlying mental health issues who have no job prospects and lots of weapons to act out with. There's a reason we need money for public health.

And notice how quickly all the outrage goes away? When was the last time we heard about any of the Aurora victims? Are they out of hospital struggling with huge bills from loss of income and medical expenses. We need to get our priorities straight! What is the most thing now? I hope these sweet babies have taught us that we need to make some huge changes. We can not let this happen again.

dia papaya said...

A shout out to the first responders. They have been witness to so much. Sending a little love your way! Hugs!!!

Sherry said...

My thoughts exactly Misch. Prayers go out to everyone affected by this senseless, depraved act.

Sherry said...

Oh Sierra this made me cry.

audrey said...

You are right dia. It happens all the time. The news is all about ratings, being first and sensationalism and in their own way they are the ones who create the monsters by making the cowards who decide to shoot up a movie theater during a premiere or a restaurant full of families, or a school full of children into media celebrities. Their faces are all over the news and internet and somewhere out there is someone with a mental issue thinking he has to top this guy to get noticed. After all what do we teach our children on a daily basis? To be a winner, to be number one is the ultimate and that can be misinterpreted all too easily. So next week when we are sitting around our trees, this tragedy too will slip from the headlines and be replaced by the next big story.

MadLyb said...

Enty - you've accurately reflected what I and others have been thinking. Sometimes it's hard to process all the thoughts and put them into words. This is one of those times. Thank you.

Rickatoo said...

@Nutty_Flavor - there were no deaths in the knife attack in China. 22 children and 1 adult were injured.

Mango said...

I am one of those people who hates kids but Jesus Christ! I would never harm one of them!

My BFF is a teacher and last year secured a job as a virtual teacher with the county. Yes, she gets to teach FROM HOME on line. I am so glad for her. She wont ever get in the cross fire in a situation like this. *fingers crossed*

Diana G said...

I completely agree with your post. I have never hugged my 2 little boys as tight as I have been since yesterday. My oldest son is in Pre-K and when I picked him up from school yesterday - my eyes welled up with tears. This is truly a nightmare.

Trashaddict said...

The unsaid things always bug me. There were some statements yesterday that the mom knew Ryan had problems and she was concerned about him. How the hell did he get to her guns? You have absolutely no business (thanks previous poster) keeping guns in the house where someone is going through psychiatric issues. So one legal initiative could be, that if you do and your household member kills someone with those guns, you will be held accessory after the fact. I think that would give a few parents a moment of pause.
Secondly, don't talk to me about screening and offering psychotherapy. I have tons of kids I see who clearly need it and testing, and my state schools and hospital don't provide us with enough resources to do it. When we can offer it, it's hard for parents who are barely scraping by economically to get their kids to sessions. Cause it won't help their families much if they lose their jobs from missing work.
Last, we need to treat violent acting out as a public health hazard, to put real money into research into the roots of violence and understanding how to help people defuse this kind of destructive rage from building up. Although I am not religious, going to church used to help many people gain this kind of self-control (of course not everyone), but there are very few influences out there now, trying to help people develop it.

Elle said...

Yes. Very well said. I have nieces this age and it makes my heart break when I think of their innocence.

urban chaos said...

Gut wrenching, just gut wrenching.

My heart is with the precious babies who lost their futures, their parents, siblings, grandparents and communities who have to go back to quiet joyless homes where so much promise once was..and to those selfless teachers who remain heroes protecting their charges.

I am ticked off too about the we have gun laws talk and if the school had guns or teachers could carry arms. More firepower, instant access and mass weaponry isn't the answer here! Guns are made for the purpose of shooting and killing or injuring so the BS of guns don't kill people nonsense is absurd, they obviously can and do.

Mental illness needs to be taken in to the big picture as does some universal regulation on firearms.

My heart broke here in Canada for all of the parents- I wish I could offer them a small measure of comfort and peace in what should be a joyous season. Instead, I can only look for positives and light in the world and do my best to pay some of that forward in honour of those beautiful people who had their lights burn out far too soon.

MISCH said...

@SusanB

OMG, I can't even imagine.....

but the truth is we hear about things every day, someone gets pushed on the subway track, another person is randomly stabbed in the street ...
you really need to be on high alert...and it seems to get worse around the holidays .

BFSkinnerchick said...

This made me cry too. It was beautifully written... Hugs and prayers to the families. My heart aches for them.

CamColty said...

I'm crying too

BFSkinnerchick said...

Wow, that's powerful and painful to read. I agree with your idea to raze the school. I'm going to hug my kids again right now.

CamColty said...

This was not even close to being offensive. It's the god damn truth ! Gun laws need to be re written. It's about time.

Stefa-fa said...

Thank you Enty.

Love to all and hugging my girl as much as possible.

Diana G said...

I'm sorry you had trouble sleeping, as well. I pray the families heal over time and find strength. May those innocent children rest in peace.

Stefa-fa said...

@MISCH, Thank you for pointing out the need for more focus on mental health (and our need for social services), I've been inundated with the "ban guns!" ranting hitting everywhere when it's mental health that needs the focus. I am glad to see others who recognize where we need reform.

xo

888 said...

urban chaos, you're not even American, you don't have guns there so why do you feel the need to opine on our gun laws? We don't tell you how you should live so please extend the same courtesy to us, especially when so many Canadians like to get all indignant about the US's interference in other countries.

VIPblonde, not everyone carries a gun for fun. I carry because I have been the victim of rape and I refuse to be a victim ever again. If you feel safe trusting others, then good for you but not everyone does, and you don't have the right to decide what is acceptable self protection for other people. Your rights do not trump mine, especially my constitutional rights, no matter how cutesy you try to be about it.

Of course, none of you would EVER consider the possibility that violent media might have some sort of role in this, but blaming inanimate objects is perfectly rational. It's very simple. If you don't want guns, then don't have them. If you don't like living in a country with a Constitutional right to bear arms, then feel free to move to a gun free utopia like Mexico or South Africa. Or better yet, ask anyone who survived Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot and any of the other benevolent dictators that outlawed guns what they think about gun control. For a bunch of college educated elitists you'd think you would be aware of that basic history but I guess not. Also if you don't think this government is capable of doing that here, then you haven't been paying attention. You might want to look up Bill Cooper's comments on this mass shooting phenomenon. I'd say you could ask his opinion but he's dead, having been shot by our benevolent government agents.

katsm0711 said...

@egee I don't like to discuss politics but I think Obama deserves this. He's not my first choice for president, but I never saw a president that emotionally upset before. I felt like all he wanted to do was get it over with and run home to hug his girls. I just wanted to push them together knowing he would probably be stuck "working" for a few hours. I think if anyone can find a solution for our gun violence, Obama being from Chicago should have very good ideas. I know the people in charge have to focus on other more important things that we may not realize exist, so I understand when the president has to skip over homelessness, reproductive rights, but I hope our in house massacres get bumped up the list. A reporter today said and I quote "meanwhile the news from the LATEST shooting..." that really hit me. It's time. We need to stop debating on if it's guns or people and assign a team of experts to study us and decide once and for all where the problem stems from. I've always been firm that it's not guns it's crazy people that kill but I don't even care about being right anymore. If I'm wrong and you guys that say the answer is to take away our guns I DON'T CARE. I don't even think our government has ever done anything to figure out what started this mass murder epidemic. I will support any solution, it just doesn't seem like our government is doing a single thing to fix it.

888 said...

Of course my heart breaks for these people though, that should go without saying but it does not mean that law abiding people who can be responsible should be punished. I have kids too which is also another reason I carry. I'd rather die fighting then cowering in a corner sobbing and sniveling, begging a monster to spare me. Been there, won't do it again.

auntliddy said...

Maybe a security system, that when breached, or a gun detected, automatically locks up school and each indiviual classroom with bulletproof doors. Maybe 'safe room' inside classroom, bulletproof. Extreme? Yes, but schools not an easy soft target anymore.

katsm0711 said...

@911 I didn't realize how traumatizing your job is. My neighbor had the day off but he would have been with his EMT partner as he was first on the scene. He told me neighbor it was so hard bc they were there ready to save lives and over 40 staff at the hospital ready n waiting, but the emt's weren't allowed near the bodies inside the school for a long time until they were sure they knew there were no more shooters loose. I asked my neighbors mom if Ryan was glad or sad that he wasn't there to help. Neighbor said as a mom she's glad her son didn't have to see such horror and it sounds like the son is undecided too. Then she told me how all you guys need so much therapy after such horrible things. It never occurred to me that u guys are not made of stone so I want to say thanks. I don't know how u hold it together when someone on the phone is in hysterics describing sobering god awful and you just have to think logically and decide what kind of help they need.

Tuxedo Cat said...

@888

We have lots of guns in Canada. I'm not quite sure what made you think that, but I wouldn't be surprised if there were more per capita.

Sherry said...

First of all 888 my sincere sympathies regarding being the victim of a violent heinous crime. Now I begin to understand the root of your justified anger perpetrated by a mentally ill, cruel bastard.

Second of all Canada does allow firearms. They just have different laws than ours.

I wish we had zero guns. Just do and no apologies for that. I think in cases such as this we all search for ways to prevent senseless shit how ever much it may fly in the face of what other people appreciate as actual fteedoms.

Net/ net : especially in regards to your personal experience let's all try to view all sides before we think that's the one true solution to a heinous situation. My take still is that mental illness needs a closer examination

PuggleWug said...

VIP, I am ready to block updates from certain buddies on Facebook until this dies down a bit. I am so sick of people cheering our governor on now about a recent bill concerning guns (I am in Michigan), or others stating what "would have" happened if people in the school were armed.

PuggleWug said...

I believe the school was already locked up, and he still managed his way in. Is anyone else disgusted by NBC atm? They have dubbed this 'Tragedy at Sandy Hook' like it is a goddamned movie. Also, I was forced to watch Lauer on the weekend, which also sucked.

katsm0711 said...

@pug the school was locked up so the murderer used his semi automatic rifle to shoot through the glass to get in. He had 3 guns on him. I believe 2 handguns? And definitely the big rifle. I just saw that all of the victims were shot by the rifle.
I was annoyed at the local tv news and even all the reporters on twitter. The damn associated press ran false info as confirmed and then everyone else picked it up and ran with it. I hate to repeat the negative things, but this is an exact tweet yesterday from a local reporter who was "quoting" CBS news, "as many as 20 deaths. UNCONFIRMED" that's the exact news. That's what it was like all day yesterday. And then a minute later they went sorry about that incorrect fact we reported and then made up some dumb reason.
If you want to read local news look up "Connecticut post" newspaper on FB or their homepage. They had two really nice articles about 2 of the teachers. Or The Newtown Patch is another paper and one of the writers lost his mother in law. Just if anyone far away wants to know more.

liteNOTSObrite said...

This ^^^^^^^

ReesesPeace said...

Haven't been able to sleep, can't stop weeping. Those poor, poor babies. I am a member of the Empty Arms Syndrome...I know some of what those parents are going through and will continue to go through.And, I just can't with the survivin kids. I hope to rally in the next couple days, but right now... I'm just too raw...staying away from FB and all that...just wanna send out my hugs and love.

katsm0711 said...

@reeses I just had to google that and I'm so sorry, I hope you're ok. I just tried to look at the news just now and i got all upset again. I think you're best off staying away from media and getting quick updates as you feel up to it. There's no reason you have to watch it all day.

ReesesPeace said...

@kats...thanks, but I don't have TV...so glad I decided not to get TV. What you wrote way up there at the beginning...beautiful, Kats.

I'll be okay...eventually. Something's got to give, though.

E Gee Be said...

Oh, Reeses, please try to stop watching, my heart breaks for you and all parents who have those empty arms, the name alone just paints the saddest picture. I wish you strength and peace this weekend and always.
And Katsm and the others who have written so beautifully here today, thank you. Tuxedo, you are not blabbing about yourself, and I appreciate your perspective.

__-__=__ said...

Thank you 888. Better and more informed breeding would be a start. Why not DNA test before you make babies. Health is a good thing, both physical and mental.

cyberisis said...

I live about 20 minutes away. Putting on a brave face for my little one but I am torn apart inside. She does not know anything yet but I will have to tell her something before school on Monday on case kids are talking about it.

ReesesPeace said...

My heart breaks for those of you with wee ones and needing to tell them something. We adults are having a hard time understanding...how the hell do you tell kids, yes, honey, evil exists and it could happen to you. Odds are it won't, but it could. Okay, yeah, that's not how you say it to a kid...babbling here. Forgive me.

penelope said...

I agree with more services to detect mental health issues in children and young people before it is too late. We have a 5th grader in our school who hangs around where the K, 1 and 2 graders play. This boy goes up to them and kicks the legs out from under these kids and laughs as they fall flat on the ground and cry. Some get injured by his actions. He bullies them and teases them and laughs when they get hurt.

When we report his behavior, the administration keeps him indoors during lunch/recess for a week then sends him back out. They can't have him evaluated because the parents refuse to believe there is something wrong with him. He is a budding sociopath who does not feel empathy for anyone else. The only time he cries is when he gets punished because he is is upset that he can't do what he wants to do.

Unfortunately, their is no system in place up here in Canada to deal with this other than maybe sending him to another school. :0(

auntliddy said...

<3

auntliddy said...

Similiar situation in my grandsons class and my granddaughter, only not so mean. Just inappropiate comments, flashing his butt. Parents insist nothing is wrong, but theses kids takes up tons of time from the other kids.

__-__=__ said...

Those poor babies and those poor women. Just too sad. I am happy I don't have cable tv. Reading about this is horrific. All those dead were doing no harm. Senseless. So many good lives lost. And again, many people knew the shooter had problems.

Zeeky_Boogy_Doog said...

Sad thing is the school's policy of seeing you first on a monitor then buzzing you in, wouldn't work with him... they would have let him in. All he would have to do is show up, say "I'm Ms. Lanza's son, she's not here today, she forgot something in her desk."

(I didn't hear whether they let him or if he forced his way. Regardless, it sucks.)

Dia, good point. We rarely hear about the victims of previous shootings after it happens, like what's happened with their medical bills and recovery. There was something about Columbine victims being bankrupted by the bills, but I may be remembering it wrong.

WBotW said...

My 9 year old son has severe, severe ADHD and although he is medicated, he does behave oddly. He is grandiose, often inappropriate, moody, and explosive. He is one of those kids that people give the side eye to because he likes to make costumes and dress up in them, or sing weird songs, behave over-the-top hyperactive. I am a single mother of three and spend a lot of nights bawling my eyes out because I am failing in so many ways as a mother. He takes up a lot of time, and I am sure that some of the 'normal' kids don't get as much time as they might because of him and the other special needs kids in the class. Here are a few other things about my special needs son with mental health issues I would like to share. When a kid on his hockey team scores his first goal EVER, my boy, who has never and likely will never accomplish this, and who is not friends with that kid, is the first person to cheer his teammate on, and tell him how awesome this is. When a kid who used to throw food at him at lunch time and trip him in the playground at recess gets hurt during PE, my son is the first one to run over, see if he is okay, and take off to get a grown up. When a teacher, or friend's mom gets a haircut, or wears a new pair of shoes, my boy will notice right away and compliment her, telling her how pretty she looks. When my toddler wants to watch a Tinkerbell movie, my boy will put it on, and watch it with her, talking about all the fairies and later helping her dress up as Tink by making her a costume. Yeah, he pulls down his pants sometimes in front of us, because he thinks his butt is an object of amusement. Yes, when he gets frustrated he yells, screams, throws things, and refuses to accept that he is wrong. Yes, my kid has mental health issues, as I suspect the ADHD diagnosis may be hiding early-onset bipolar. Btw: they won't diagnose young kids with bipolar until they hurt themselves or someone else. Awesomeness. In any case, my son is one of those kids that people are already talking about locking up NOW before they can grow up to do this sort of thing. Face the reality: the majority of rapists and murderers are not 'mentally ill', in that they have been diagnosed. 'Normal' kids are the ones who go around bullying other kids, like the shits who ruined Amanda Todd's life. 'Normal' kids are the ones who make the lives of artistic and intelligent kids hell. 'Normal' kids grow up to be Scott Peterson, Sean Vincent Gillis, etc. From what I have read, Adam was diagnosed with Asperger's; this sort of act is NOT typical of autism, and if this was the only diagnosis that there was, then it isn't surprising his mother thought it was safe to own firearms. This whole thing is so unspeakably tragic, for everyone involved.

Kloie said...

I'm sorry, Reese's.

AuntJess said...

Of Reese's my love to you baby girl

ReesesPeace said...

@WBotW...I'm so, so, so very sorry...there are no easy, simple solutions, are there? Tight hugs to you, sweetie.

We all need more kindness and love and tenderness. You guys are a wonderful group of people here and I feel blessed to be able to vent here and not be judged for it.

<3

figgy said...

I'm crying too. Again.

Lola said...

Peace to all of us.

We are better than this.

E Gee Be said...

Me too, figgy.
WBotW, I work with kids and I know your son (figuratively, of course) and I see the challenges and the gifts that your son and kids that might not be described as "normal" bring to the lives of the people around them. I hope your son has other adults in his life that get him, and that appreciate all the wonderful, wacky, kind and interesting parts of him.

Jamie 2 said...

I just read this story about a dad who had lost his daughter, and I cried.

-- Emilie Parker, Female, 05-12-06
Fighting back tears and struggling to catch his breath, Robbie Parker, Emilie's father, told the world about a little girl who loved to draw and was always smiling, and he also reserved surprising words of sympathy for the gunman.
"She was beautiful. She was blond. She was always smiling," he said.
To the gunman's family, he said, "I can't imagine how hard this experience must be for you."
He said he struggled to explain the death to Emilie's two siblings, 3 and 4.
"They seem to get the fact that they have somebody they're going to miss very much," he said.
Parker said his daughter loved to try new things -- except for new food. And she was quick to cheer up those in need.
"She never missed an opportunity to draw a picture or make a card for those she around her," he said.
The world is a better place because Emilie was in it, he said.
"I'm so blessed to be her dad," he said.

auntliddy said...

I have nothing but respect and empathy for he mothers of special needs children. I dont know how they do it. They are completely extraordinary. As are you.

cinephreak said...

I for one did not work once yesterday.

cinephreak said...

Rest in peace much love to the victims and their families. poor babies are angels now.

Tuxedo Cat said...

@WBotW

Your boy sounds delightful. It sounds as if he has a huge heart. It's the ones with no heart that we need to worry about.

katsm0711 said...

The Westborougj baptist church is picketing Newtown tomorrow. I'm still unclear why but it seems they r celebrating gods will or some bullshit. The next person who argues with me that all Muslims are terrorists I'm going to say well we have normal Christians and the terrorist version too

dia papaya said...

Thanks to the moms for sharing their stories about their special children!

Yesterday's tragedy will not be in vain if we all decide that enough is enough. What should are new priorities be? I think it's clear we want a safer place for our children to grow up in. So let's make it that way! Can we start paying teachers, the grower and shaper of young minds, like we do are professional athletes? Can we focus on developing community ties that bring people together - teaching kids healthy ways to interact (ie less electronic devices more one on one time)?

Can we give all kids acess to free medical care? Good quality standardized care so parents don't have to chose between health care vs food or health care vs utility bills. Monthly preminums add up. Copays add up. Medicine adds up. Healthcare varies so much from state to state and most providers don't take the "poor people" insurance bc the get paid squat. And parents need time off to care for sick kids and take them to a doctor. I know a lot of people who can't take time off work to care for a sick kid. What happens then?

These are issues we need to think about. I am 100% on board with my taxes going to the children of America. Why can't we make them our priority? I don't want to make this about politics and start that fight but at some point the country has to. Aren't the kids more important than the oil companies or defense budgets or whatever else big business is wasting money on?

And re: victims of past tragedies. I want to keep tabs on them bc I care! As long as its fresh, the media cares but afterwards when the messy healing starts, where are the TV crews and helping hands? Months of rehab takes a toll on everyone. Loss of income. Loss of resources. These people shouldn't have to worry but they do. It's an ongoing revictimization when they can't pay bills, lose friends, become isolated bc they were victims. What will happen to these parents and siblings as they go through the healing process? Some of these victims will turn to drugs and alcohol to cope (and we know where that leads), commit suicide bc the loss is too painful, etc. a horrible chain of events has been set in motion and I want people to understand that and give them support so they have time to heal and grieve and hopefully go back to a "regular" life. Unfortunately fast paced America isn't really set up that way. Could you imagine going back to work after losing your child this way? Those parents need so much love! And I want them to know that in 6 months or two years that I still care about them and what they are going through!

Well now I'm just rambling. I'm hoping this makes some sense to someone. Glad we have our community to share and console each other. Hugs, dp

Tuxedo Cat said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Tuxedo Cat said...

The Westboro Church is led by Fred Phelps. That's the same crazy bastard that burned the Koran. They are not real Baptists, that is for sure. They are just political activists masquerading as a church.

I have known Baptists and there is no way in hell they would ever be associated with anything like this. These people are like 0.00001 percent of the Christian population.

I hope they arrest them. They've been arrested before.

dia papaya said...

PS - I also meant to say that health care for kiddos would include all the mental health support everyone tslked about above. I was assuming you all would get that but thought I should be clear I was talking about physical AND mental health!

PPS - a FB friend posted something about guns being legal in Switzerland. I had no idea! And most people carry but they don't have the violence we do. I'm off to research! But it makes me thing that the heart of this issue isn't really about guns vs non-guns it's a much deeper more complex problem. Why are American's so prone to violence? Maybe that is the bigger question here.

misspoppypants said...

Coming to the edge...did you write that yourself or did you quote it? I don't see where you credited it so I assume it's your own writing. Powerful.
Logistically speaking, it takes a very long time (year) to build a school. I like your idea, I think it's valuable, maybe even necessary, but I'm wondering how they would house the kids in the meantime. In any case, nice writing, profound, haunting.

dia papaya said...

This is fascinating! There is a break down by country of gun policy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics


And if I saw the Westboro Church people after losing my baby I would run them over with my car and maybe reverse and do it again. That is all I have to say about him and his congregation of lemmings.

ReesesPeace said...

The Westboro Church are beyond repulsive. Shame on them for using their *god*...if there's a god, I'd like to think he/she wouldn't be so vengeful...to spew their brand of hatred. I know a lot of Christians and no one I know would condone that behavior. So very repulsive.

ReesesPeace said...

I don't know how to make the following link clicky, but if someone could do it, I would so very much appreciate it.

The Westboro Baptist Church is just beyond repulsive...I simply can't bear the thought of them being a million miles from the families.

address:

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/user/reset/24873536/1355666642/K7PdcsDMDSpkiMjf_UVRgBw94S-RGf9ru69smihVdFY

Lioness70 said...

I couldn't stop crying.

Then I gave all my kids hugs and "I love yous" when they came home.

Now they don't want to go back to school tomorrow, because they're afraid some sociopathic copycat will shoot their schools up.

We need support systems in place- badly - for troubled young men. All these shooters were between 20 and 25. We, as a society, need to get to the bottom of why this is going on.

Lelaina Pierce said...

@timebob - I feel incredibly sorry for both Ryan and his father. I can't imagine going to my job and seeing myself named as a suspect in such a horrific event and then learning my mother/brother were dead.

I don't understand why people are still saying his mother was a teacher at the elementary school? Her neighbors are all saying she was a stay at home mom and had been for awhile to deal with Adam.

I hate guns and don't want to own one but I understand those that have one for personal security reasons. I just will NEVER understand why people feel the need to have certain types of guns, such as those used in this killing spree. Obviously the bigger problem is the mental health issue.

For those that say, now is not the time to talk about it, I disagree.

I was at the mall last week, just after the Oregon mall shooting and I just kept thinking, "What if that happens here?" I only recently went to the movies since the Colorado shooting. There are so many of these shootings happening so often I kind of feel like I am in a constant state of fear when out and about. It should not be this way and what happened in Newton should not have happend. So I absolutely think we have to start talking and DOING something about this.

My heart is just broken for each of those parents and all those that lost a family member on Friday.

Momster said...

I realize that I am a oouple of days late to responding to this thread, but I've been sick and haven't logged on. . .
Before the Sandy Hook tragedy happened, early Friday morning an 18-year old man was arrested in my town, on charges that he was planning to barricade students in the high school auditorium, chain the doors shut, and shoot everyone. Luckily he told some friends, who reported it to police, and he's being held on $1 million bond.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/15/sammie-eaglebear-chavez_n_2307864.html


This was my youngest son's high school, he's a senior. . .

I'm heartbroken over this tragedy, all those young lives--and the adults that heroically tried to save them.

auntliddy said...

And you are NOT failing. You are playing the hand life dealt you.

auntliddy said...

We dont have to pay any attention to crazy people, and i hope no one does.

WBotW said...

My son is REALLY fortunate to have an amazing teacher this year, one who loves how different he is and believes he can and will do great things. This is a vid of my boy's part in the Xmas concert last week: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzI5aMzy2Ac

He is the little guy walking around with the drum. He would beat out 'what's your name' and each child would beat back their names. The fact that he pulled this off, with the colours, lights, etc, all those distractions... it makes me want to cry in a good way. The fact that his teacher believed he could do it, and gave him the chance? Phenomenal. People like her are the reason that a lot of kids who could go down a bad path don't.

Reese's: {{{HUGS}}} you are a lovely person and I wish you much joy xoxo

Everyone else: thank you for the kind words. People here, for the most part, don't get my son and don't see what I see.

Land Manatee said...

Just wondering...Does anyone else think there may have been a group organizing school mass shootings for this past Friday. I have read at least 2 other articles that mention the arrest of other men across the nation that had planned to carry out shootings on Friday. I think one CDAN pister just posted something in relation to one of the targeted school's was the one her son attends.

Is it all coincidence? Hummm...just wondering. Thank God the other men have been arrested and Friday didn't turn out to be any worse.

Land Manatee said...

*poster