Sunday, November 04, 2012

Kate Gosselin Gets Upset About Her Kids Playing With Pit Bulls

Jon Gosselin's girlfriend Tweeted a photo of one of his kids being licked by the family pit bull. Apparently Kate Gosselin hated this and doesn't want her kids anywhere near pit bulls because she is afraid her kids will be hurt. It is not like she didn't know Jon had a pit bull. Has the pit bull bit anyone before? Ever showed signs of aggression? I'm guessing it hasn't or Kate would not even let her kids go over there. Of course, Kate does worry about other things too. It turns out the place she loves to get hair done had its power knocked out by Sandy and it really inconvenienced Kate because she wanted to get her hair done.

114 comments:

CamColty said...

Umm why the hell is this post ? I wouldn't want a pitbull liking my child's face either. What does her wanting her hair done have anything to do with this ?

MISCH said...

My friends have pit bulls and they're the smartest most loyal dogs....it's not the dog it's the owner.
Pit Bulls get a bad rap

seaward said...

I'm predicting this post will turn into a huge fight & get the most comments of the day.
1, 2, 3 GO!

shiny_special_one said...

This bitch will do whatever she can for attention. Gawd, how I wish I never had to hear about her again.

J Sara said...

Agreed!!! Thank you for saying it :)

FrenchGirl said...

pitbull or not, you always need to be careful when a kid is with a dog

CarmeliteLady said...

I used to always be on the hating pit bulls train because of their history, but my husband loves them and his family owns two of them. They are really very sweet, loving, submissive, great family dogs. If they are properly trained. Lots of big dogs can be out of control and rowdy if they're not trained. It's just if you're a stranger and in their yard that you should be concerned. As you can see from this picture there is no malice or evil in this dogs eyes. Pit bulls are scary but they aren't all bad dogs. Like any dog it depends on the owner, the environment and the situation. There are lots of dogs that can be aggressive towards other dogs, it happens all the time on Carmel beach. A large dog attacked and killed a jack russell terrier a couple of months ago on the beach. I can't imagine going through that, my heart really goes out to that dog owner.

FrenchGirl said...

@MISCH totally true

Jason said...

I didn't think I could dislike Kate any more, but then she comes along with that anti-pit bull ignorance and I'm proven wrong once again.

shiny_special_one said...

Kate Gosselin might indeed be ignorant enough to believe that pit bulls are inherently dangerous, but I think publicity and attention are her primary motivation here.

Robert said...

100 years ago, pit bulls were known as "babysitter dogs" just because of their loyalty and devotion to protecting the children in the family. It's all in the way they are raised; if you ever saw "Pit Boss" you know what they can be like.

rejectedcarebear said...

Pit bulls are only as dangerous as their owners. I own a pit that I adopted at 2 years old who was abused. He is the most loving and loyal dog. He is so gentle with my nieces and nephew (and my cats!) and has never been agressive with them. Would I leave him alone with the baby? No but you should never leave a dog alone with a baby.

mygeorgie said...

Coming from Kate, who's a pitbull-of-a-mother, this is pretty ironic. But given the twat that is Jon, i'd be worried about the pittie not being trained properly too.

ureallyannoyme said...

I think the kids would be better off if they were raised by the pitbull than either one of their biological parents.

katsm0711 said...

I've played with 3 pit bulls, totally fearless, rolling on the floor with them wrestling. I had zero fear they would hurt me. I'm not sure if this is true but one of the owners said he used to feed his gunpowder and trained it to fight but then he changed his life around and now only gave the dog love and it's super friendly now. So I'm wondering, can sweet pit bulls still go into "attack mode" if something sets them off, like a kid who doesn't know to be relaxed? Do out bulls have an "attack" gene or is it just that their jaws are so powerful and can lock? Or am I totally wrong? Oh and I know a couple, one is an animal control officer the wife works at my vet. They have 3 kids and at least 3 pit bulls right now and they say they are just normal dogs.

katsm0711 said...

Sorry one more thing. I used to watch The People's Court a lot and whenever it was a dog case, it was always a pitbull and the judge hates them. Was that just to brainwash us?

Robin the Mad Photographer said...

ureallyannoyme: AMEN! Given that the poor kids do seem to be stuck with these two sperm & egg donors as guardians (I hesitate to use the word "parents"), they're probably happier and less neurotic with Jon than with Kate. Really, Kate doesn't need to bitch about her salon being closed due to Sandy for me to dislike her; she's earned that dubious honor looooong before now.

Scandalous Candice said...

Pitbulls are always demonized. They are proven to be loyal and very family friendly dogs. With all pets, any breed, you should be careful with your kids and how you raise the pets. But this freak out over pit bulls only shows ignorance and perpetuates the false notion that they are dangerous dogs. They are trained that way and abused that way. All pets have potential to be bad or vicious like that. But stop taking it out on innocent pets.

Kate Gosselin is a vicious hag who beats her kids with spoons. They ought to muzzle that bitch.

E Gee Be said...

Robert! Exactly what I was going to say! They were used on large estates to babysit and follow the children around. The little rascals dog was an American Staff! We had our girl for almost 14 years, and she was the sweetest, gentlest dog around. She loved to play hockey r soccer with my SOS friends, because she was the best goalie! Don't usually enter into the fray on this topic, but I strongly agree with those who know it is the owner, not just the breed.

jennifer hansen said...

a pitbull killed my friends dog. pitbulls are ugly & vicious animals. oh btw my friend was just walking her dog around the neighborhood when a pitbull came charging out of a house killing her dog.

distracted said...

My young daughter and I have a rescued pit bull. We love her with all of our hearts. She is a good dog. Many of your might remember Petie from The Little Rascals was a pit bull? I don't remember much outrage about Petie. Before pit bulls were made fighting dogs, they were known as great 'nanny dogs' for children. Also, one of the first war dogs to receive medal of honor was a pit bull name sargent stubs or stubby. you can google it. Also, Helen Keller famously had a pit bull for a service dog. Don't believe the hype. These dogs are brilliant.

distracted said...

Also, I was bit in the face by a Yorkshire Terrier! They are evil dogs! We must abolish all Yorkshire Terriers or the children will die and our arctic ice caps will melt with fury!

msgirl said...

kats - I would be careful, unfortunately those dogs were raised aggressively and you never know what will spook them.

Riased by good dog owners, pits can be the best! So playful, so sweet, my German Shepherd used to love playing with them because they love to wrestle hard right back, and the pit owners wouldn't freak out!

msgirl said...

But I hate to say it - most of the fights at the dog park involved a pit. The owners were crap.

Mother Campfire said...

Hee hee

Robert said...

Ugly and vicious animals are raised by ugly and vicious people. The dogs fighting in the park were raised by crap owners.

timebob said...

the only person I wish enty would put a moratorium on posting is Kate G I hate her, I hate her fame whore ways and not in a lindsay lohan i love to hate her kind of way, he is just and energy sucking vampire and doesn't deserve anything good in life, she needs to go back to obscurity, which is the thing she fears most

katsm0711 said...

Wow these pitbull facts are so interesting! I love these dog talks here bc I'm planning to adopt my first in a few months and it's so helpful to get so many different bits of advice.

djphob said...

The "nanny dog" thing is a total myth. Try and find a citation. Ain't there.

Mrswife29 said...

I own a pit bull and she's a cupcake. My dachshund on the other hand: watch out-- he's fucking vicious. I have to keep him away from people, esp. kids!

Serenity_Now said...

I was chased down and attacked by a neighbor's pit when I was nine years old. The neighbor used to do horrible things to the puppies as part of their training, and no matter which authorities my parents called, nothing was ever done about it. As an adult, I love all dogs, including pits. But stupid, ignorant people scare the piss out of me. Go figure.

Hollyweird said...

OMFG THAT CHILD IS BEING ATTACKED BY A PITTBULL.... with kisses. All I see is love in that photo.

I love Pitt Boss. Pitbulls and Parolees is also a great show.

ljsmed said...

I have mixed feelings about Pits, even when trained well something can set him/her off and when it happens it can be scary. I know this from experience. Most all of the time my friends pit (who was very loved, treated, and trained well) was a total sweetheart but I saw it attack someone for no apparent reason. I'm sure there was something that set her off but it was very scary, they are just so strong. Sometimes unpredictable also.

ljsmed said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Renoblondee said...

@ljsmed I totally agree with your statement.

misspeg86 said...

@katsm0711 same thing with Judge Judy! But I don't think JJ hates them. She just said they are aggressive and need to be dealt with extra care.

HudsonJoe said...

More than other dogs I don't trust pitbulls. I live in an urban area where too many terminal ends of the alimentary canal breed and train for aggression in the breed.

Yet I know very very sweet pit bulls my niece has one a rescue who is a sweetie.

Would I adopt one probably not. I am kind of sedentary and don't have out door space where they could play unattended so we would not be a great fit. An older one who has slowed down maybe.

sifichick said...

3 years ago I rescued a pit mix off the streets. When I first got her I did a LOT of research because I'd heard all the horror stories about pits.

The TRUE pit line is actually a great breed of dog. They DON'T have an "attack" gene. What they have is game. Game is what drives the Pit Bull. It's what makes the keep going until the job is done. Which is why they can be viewed as vicious. In the original line if a puppy showed ANY aggressive behavior towards a human they would be put down. This was done so the line wouldn't have that trait in them. They were known as the nanny dog because they are fiercely loyal with their families.

I've had Zoey for 3 years. She has become the BEST dog I've ever had. She's the happiest & most loving dog I've ever had. Her mission in life is to give kisses & play. I have only seen her get truly aggressive once. 2 men broke into my backyard. I was home at the time & didn't hear them just the fence. Zoey heard them & tore out of here with a growl I've never heard in my life. She saved me from either being murdered or raped. Needless to say the guys went back over the fence.

I will NEVER regret keeping Zoey. She is a hell of a dog. Like it's already been said a lot of it has to do with the owner & the breeding of the dog. A good line of a Pit breeds good puppies. Bad lines breed bad puppies. Same with owners. Bad owners train bad dogs. Good owners train good dogs.

Angela said...

Crazies started around the 1950s breeding pits to fight, if they were "gentle" dogs then they were eliminated from the gene pool. Now almost all pits have inherent aggressive tendencies, I would never leave a kid alone with one for a second.

Lola said...

Just as a factual point, the American Staffordshire Terrier (often erroneously referred to as the American Bull Terrier) and the Pitbull are two different dogs. Pitbulls originated as a cross between Amstaffs and Bulldogs. It is the Amstaff that was used to "babysit" kids and are bred to be extremely gentle and affectionate (and was the little rascals dog). Pitbulls were bred with the intention to "improve" on the Amstaff by upping its pain tolerance and aggression along with an increase in size.

None of this means that Pits can't be wonderful dogs if bred and raised responsibly. As I have said before, unfortunately, the lure of the "bully breed" (not limited to Pits) has led to unscrupulous breeding (breeding for size and aggression rather than gentle temperament) and to a number of unpredictable dogs. It is the irresponsible breeding and ownership that has led to the public perception that, unfortunately, is often accurate. It does the breed no good to argue that an aggressive population of Pits doesn't exist. It would be better to acknowledge it and confront it (as the Rottweiler community has begun to do), educate people and take the dogs that display aggressive features out of the breeding population.

As I have said, I would never own/foster a Pit (or any other "bully breed") of unknown parentage or background with my 12 year old child, or other animals, in the house.

bobbi_1025 said...

@katsmo I highly recommend a boxer if you have the patience for obedience. They have a lot of energy too and can be a live wire but honestly they are wonderful if given firm training. I've had 2 with 3 kids and dogsat another for a neighbor and never had a problem.

As for pits, my family bred and raised them. I used to sleep in the doghouse with them. One of the males we had had been fought but I don't remember there being any problems with them. My fav female, both her parents were straight fighting dogs but there was not a single ounce of aggression to her.

I asked a week or so ago about my son being bit by my grandmothers dog and what to do, and I thank you all for the suggestions, but what I didn't put was that my oldest daughter was attacked by my mothers dog about 5 years ago. The dog ripped one side of her lip open and also seperated a nostril. Not to mention other cuts on her face. She had to have reconstructive surguery and received over 65 stitches in just her face. The point I'm getting at is this, the surgeon asked what kind of dog did it and when I told him he said regardless of what the media says he has treated less pitbull injuries than other breeds.

A lot of times the aggression of a dog does have to do with the owner and the way they are being raised. In other cases like my mom, I think it is just the dog itself. That dog had issues and they refused to do what needed to be done until my daughter got bit. He had previously bit my stepdad multiple times. Now, they have the same breed and she is an excellent dog and great with all kids. But I have learned no breed is not without exceptions as far as being aggressive. Some just make better news stories and have shittier owners than others.

Alma said...

I think there will always be people who should not have kids or dogs. Maybe less with the dumbass girlfriends and the dogs and be more about paying your child support and being a devoted father. Laid back is one way to describe him and so is lazy. Damn, these kids already have quality time and attention divided eight ways. Do they have to share it with your new skank too?

Lola said...

@Angela...

Both dogs were historically bred, to some degree, to participate in dog fights (which used to be as common and accepted as horse racing) but the fighting aggression was generally not the dominate characteristic that was sought. Having said that, it is because of the desire to fight that both breeds often don't mix well with other pets.

@MrsWife...dachshunds were originally bred to hunt and kill badgers. Because of this, they have a large sense of self and are often somewhat aggressive if not properly directed and given a job to do.

KimT said...

Kate-You are an IDIOT and your 15 minutes was over a Lo-o-o-o-ng time ago. You continue to show your ignorance. Pit Bulls are lovely , sweet, demonized animals. Please JUST GO AWAY!!!!!

PixieVintage said...

I love dogs. We own 3 wonderful dogs but i wouldn't leave them alone with children. That is just responsible dog ownership.
As to the pitbull nanny dog stories. Sadly it is a myth.
http://thetruthaboutpitbulls.blogspot.co.uk/2010/08/nanny-dog-myth-revealed.html?m=1

Mrswife29 said...

@Lola, I wih I had known more about dach temperaments and proper training. He's my baby and very sweet to those he likes, but he is unpredictable with others. Since he's 10 yrs old, I just crate him when people come over.

For anyone whose interested, check out Beyond The Myth, a documentary about pits and the misperceptions of the breed.

J Sara said...

Love it!!!

Angela said...

Lola, I love dogs, I'm a dog person, I'm also an RN 15 years at a large metro hospital i have never seen a kid who had half their face torn off by a dachshund.

juicy said...

You've never dated someone with kid(s), I assume. They've been separated or divorced, whatever, for years right? He can't move on and have another relationship? He's seeing his kids and the one in the snapshot doesn't seem to be unhappy. Chill.

trudi said...

I understand people loving their pitbulls. But please appreciate the people who want nothing to do with your animal and don't care how sweet you claim it is. Please keep them contained to your property and always leased when you are walking it.

I understand Kate's point. What are the odds that Jon is a responsible pet owner?

juicy said...

@trudi - please also be a responsible dog owner and keep your ankle biter leashed as well. I'm more freaked out by the neighbor across the streets yorkie mix whatever that bumrushes my car and literally tries to crawl up me, ripping my pants or poking holes, than I am about the other neighbors docile lab/pit rescue pup.

Lola said...

@Angela, dachshunds tend to bite as opposed to holding on, ripping and mauling. Also, being obviously short in stature, Dachshund bites tend to occur on the lower extremities.

One of the meanest dogs I've ever known was a dachshund who would chase and bite (if he was able) any person outside of his family.

I'm not knocking dachshunds, they can be great little dogs. Most people, however, don't realize what they were bred to do and therefore what kind of personalities they have and what kind of owner they require.

Anotheramy said...

I have a scar on my face from a GSD, Ive been bit by two of my friends three yorki poos, my son has a scar from the neighbors chihuahua. My other son was bit by our golden mix. I have a pit mix that is the biggest baby. She gets a bird or a mouse in her mouth and hasnt a clue what to do with it. She bites me when I try to clip her nails but not hard.
Whomever said terriers were bred not to give up above is right. All dog breeds bite but the pit doesn't let go or stop. Their jaws are strong so instead of leaving teeth marks, they tear flesh off.

Lola said...

@bobbi... "Injuries" often do not happen with pits...death does. Other dogs bite but don't hold on. Pits (and other dogs in this category) bite, hang on and rip., only pausing to gnaw in an attempt to get a better hold. Imagine the injuries your child would have sustained if a breed that held on and tried to rip and tear had attacked her face instead of one who "just" bit. This is the problem when breeds like this attack. The game is not injuring the "opponent" it is permenantly disabling/killing it.

Also, depending on where you live, the incidence of Pit attacks may be virtually nonexistent as they have been banned and/or very tightly regulated (ie muzzled at all times) in many communities.

Topper Madison said...

ALL dogs are dangerous. ALL dogs are also NOT dangerous. It's all in how you are taught to respect, understand, and communicate with them. I have a rescue who was a crazed psycho pooch three years ago (he had a rough 4-year start in life,) but now he's calm, loving, playful, and very gentle. He loves belly-rubs.

I see no problem with this dog kissing this kids face. The kid isn't frightened either. Let them bond.

Lola said...

I wish all people researched the dogs they are interested in. Temperment , size...lack of information is the #1 reason dogs end up in shelters.

Nonetheless, I am so glad you recognize and acknowledge your dogs temperment and make sure that other people aren't affected. You can't change the past but you're being a good owner. Kudos.

Alma said...

No but i do have children and do not bring every person i date around my children. Unless you plan on marrying the person they don't need to be around your kids. That is selfish.

Alma said...

Also, of course they look happy. Are you really that naive? Would you post pics of your kids crying? Jon does not have primary custody, meaning he has a lot more time to screw around with his girlfriend. Visitation is supposed to be for the kids. It's called being a decent parent.

Lioness70 said...

Bitch, put your hair up in a fucking ponytail.

Power isn't coming back when YOU snap your fingers.

Anyway, thanks for educating me about Pits today. My stepson had two Pit mixes, and they were the sweetest girls. They get a bad rap that's undeserved.

LSC said...

@ureallyannoyme: YES! Jon + Kate = MAJOR fail as humans.

Steph.livelaughlove said...

A German Shepard and lab mix killed my little dog. I was walkin in the neighborhood and it was on a leash and it came out of nowhere. It was an ugly vicious dog. But I don't hate all German shepherds or Labrador retrievers. I'm not that closed minded.

Angela said...

Thank you, 15 years of hearing, " it's a sweet dog", really? Tell that to the 4 year old that sweet dog just mauled.

PuggleMommy said...

The dogs are basically the kid's pets, when visiting their dad. Didn't they used to have a few German Shepards? I honestly Kate was looking to get some attention, hence the "concern". I don't think Jon having pitbulls is news to Kate.

GemTwist said...

My cat was killed by a lab. A girl next door to me was mauled by a great Dane. And I was bit in the face by a cocker spaniel as a child. Any dog can have the capacity to bite, because they're, duh, animals. I've owned and fostered pit bulls and all I can say is: There is a reason they are called 'Nanny dogs'. I'll never own anything else. People are so deliberately ignorant and bigoted about pit bulls it's stunning. 'Ugly and vicious'...what an idiot.

CK76 said...

A pitbull killed my friend's mom:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2209812/Horror-pit-bull-mauls-60-year-old-death-just-recovered-heart-transplant.html

GemTwist said...

They have a high prey drive, as do shepherd and most terrier breeds. The difference is that they're solid muscle and have huge mouths so it's easier for them to hurt something. I've never seen that happen though. A rescue I worked with got a few of the Vick dogs and we've never heard of a problem with them. Actually almost all of the Vick dogs were successfully rehabbed. They just want love. They are normal dogs. And no, they do NOT have locking jaws. Total myth.

GemTwist said...

I'm a citation. This happens in my house daily. How's that?

Agent**It said...

CK, that's is a heartbreaking story. So very sorry for their loss.

GemTwist said...

You know what a really great way to get to understand dogs is? Volunteering to walk them at your local shelter. Experience with a bunch of different dogs is a great way to figure out what you're looking for as an owner.

PuggleMommy said...

Just from reading the article, it sounded like the owners didn't have a good handle on the dogs to begin with. If the cops are called multiple times over your dogs, it's time to think about sticking with easier animals. I'm not trying to criticize your friend or her mother. I could not imagine watching those I love dealing with such a tragedy.

GemTwist said...

Yeah, don't eeeever get a pit bull please. The reason most of them get so yard-aggressive is ignorant owners leaving them outside, unattended for hours. They have literally nothing to do but watch their yard and they get super territorial. AS DO ALL BREEDS LEFT OUTSIDE UNSUPERVISED.

Solus said...

I think as much as any dog can attack a human, or snap regardless of their owners as others have mentioned a pitbull can do so much more damage! I don't care if others have them, but I do definitely feel a wave of fear rush over me when Im walking my 6 month old girl in the pram and I see a pit bull roaming around the streets without an owner! Irresponsible dog owners are the worst. While I would like to own a large dog, with children around we will only ever have a dog that isn't capable of doing serious damage to a child if they do snap.

GemTwist said...

And btw, pit bulls have been by far the laziest dog I've ever had in my home. By like, miles and miles, the laziest bum dogs ever.

GemTwist said...

Lol. So, as such an informed adult, tell me what breed WOULD you leave a child alone with?

GemTwist said...

Good. No one so misinformed should ever own one or have a hand in raising one. But please stop using the word 'fact' or any variety of. Also, limiting yourself to dogs with known parentage eliminates virtually any foster so...good rule.

GemTwist said...

Lola please quit talking about dogs. you have no clue what you're talking about. I mean, on this topic, you are seriously obtuse.

PuggleMommy said...

@Solus, I agree. I (obviously) have a puggle. Like a pitbull, if he felt I was in danger, he would go into attack mode. The only difference is, puggles are not even close to being as strong as a pitbulls are. A puggle may cause one to get stitches, where a pit may cause one to lose a limb.

GemTwist said...

Thank you!!!

PuggleMommy said...

* As pitbulls, not as a pitbulls! *

GemTwist said...

Living on the Detroit border, I definitely feel you on the fear of lose pits or really any dog. We have for real packs of feral dogs here and it's a very frightening idea. But don't buy into the 'small dogs are safer' myth. Especially with children. While it's very true a larger dog has the ability to hurt you, a smaller dog is much, much more likely to. Children can hurt and scare animals smaller than them, causing them to snap. Doesn't matter what size the animal, they can still put an eye out.

cricket said...

The pitbulls would make much better parents than Kate any day. I would be scared to have my dog around kids that are being raised by a rabid bitch like Kate.

Mango said...

I'm not a dog person so I can't speak about them, but I know that Judge Judy greatly distrusts pit bulls. One hears tales of pit bulls mauling other dogs and people, and then there's Texas Girlie's pit bull, Sharky, who manages to live amicably with a veritable farm of various animals.

PitBullSharky

Lola said...

@Gem...

I hesitate to respond because clearly anyone who disagrees with you and/or disagrees with the idea that all Pits are lovely sweet things that would never hurt a fly is wrong and doesn't know what they're talking about; however...

You know nothing about me nor do you know anything about my experience with dogs which, unless you are a professional dog trainer or handler, I feel extraordinarily confident is a GREAT deal more vast than yours. I also have a great deal of experience with so-called "bully breeds" both very well bred and not so much. My experience is such that I was often the go to person for "advanced" dogs (including bully breeds) in the foster group I work with and have (before having a child) often agreed to take all but "redline" dogs with confidence that I could handle, and eventually socialize them.

It is most certainly a "fact" that Amstaffs and Pits are two different breeds. One is recognized by the AKC and UKC, one is not and is a derivative of the other. I'm not sure why you would argue with the factual nature of that.

The "fact" that you misstated my position on dogs of unknown parentage clearly shows you did not read what I said but instead went all ninja on anyone who dares to dispute that Pits have no problems. I never said I wouldn't have any dog of unknown parentage, I said I wouldn't have a so-called "bully breed" of unknown parentage/background around my kid. I stand by that. (There is a reason they are often referred to as "bully breeds".) I also wouldn't have any dog that had extreme socialization needs. I am a mother first and I have a responsibility to make sure my child is in a safe environment.I would question anyone who wouldn't put their child first (which is not to say that you can't have a pit around a child ever).

If you read what I said, you would know that I also stated that the Pit community does itself no favors by denying the problems within. The Rottie community did so for years, to its detriment (and the detriment of the breed). It is only when people take an honest look at the reality that the real problems can be addressed...and fixed.

I know what I'm talking about, whether you like, or agree, with what I'm saying or not. Telling people to shut up and trying to belittle their viewpoint doesn't make you right, it just makes you unpleasant.

csproat said...

@youreallyannoyme

"Better off if raised by Pitbull..."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Hilarious!.....and probably true....

figgy said...

Aaaw you and Zoey BOTH sound lucky to have each other! :-)

distracted said...

People have such short damn memories.

It used to be the doberman that everybody was afraid of or the german shephard or the rotweiler.... All of that hysteria has been since debunked and so why are people still convinced that somehow the pit bull breeds are nearly supernatural in their ability to maim or kill? Gimme a break.

My pit bull is scared of the dark.

A Gypsy said...

What gemtwist said.

trudi said...

I could Google 50 stories of pit bull killings in a minutes time. The dachshund bashes could spend the next week searching for one.

A Gypsy said...

My rescued pitbull is amazing. She has zero dog or human aggression and lives for socializing. At our local dog park she was attacked by a mutt to the point of needing to go to the vet. Even in that situation, she didn't bite back to defend herself. Her personality is gentle and predictable and ridiculously loving. I can't speak for every pitbull out there, but my experience has shown them to be perfectly deserving creatures.

katsm0711 said...

I'm not getting into this bc I've never owned a dog but I'm hoping to weed out the correct info here. I think what might end this debate of my dog's better than yours is if someone can post FACTUAL statistics comparing dog bites that are non life-threatening to fatal per breed, and very important, the numbers of any type of bite per breed.

Lola said...

Trudi, I hope you don't think I'm bashing dachshunds, they're great little dogs but need an owner with a strong personality. My grandma used to have one named Shayna...she was a great dog.


Oops. I better shut up since @Gemtwist and @A Gypsy have determined that I don't know even the smallest thing about dogs...so don't mind me.

Lola said...

@kat...

Here is a link:

http://dogbitelaw.com/dog-bite-statistics/the-breeds-most-likely-to-kill.html

Please disregard this site is a dog bite attorney and scroll about 1/3 way down. There is a link in parentheses entitled "Clifton, Dog Attacks and Maimings" click on that link. I would link that but it is a download.

It breaks it down into breeds, age of people attacked deaths, etc. It also describes different types of dog bites.

It is very exhaustive.

Lola said...

Towards the top of the link I copied is another study in the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Assn.


Note that Pitbulls account for over 1/2 of bites causing bodily harm and nearly 1/2 of the fatal attacks. The next closest was the Rottweiler which had less than 1/2 as many bites as the Pitbull overall and slightly more than 1/2 as many deaths as a result of the attack.

I have not, thus far found a statistic showing me the percentage of bites within the Pitbull population as a comparison.

Zeeky_Boogy_Doog said...

Katsm0711 - I'm not an expert on breeds or anything, but one I always found to be easy and an all around "good dog" is the Golden Retriever. Wonderful dogs!

One breed I'd say you shouldn't consider as your first dog is the Westies... they are so cute, they're on the Cesar dog food ads, but they're very energetic; bred for chasing critters underground. They're wonderful, but they need jobs and challenges. If you like those little types, something like a Maltese or Shih-Tsu are easier.

Zeeky_Boogy_Doog said...

A lot of people buy pitbulls and "badass" breeds to show off, or in worse cases, to fight them. My old neighbor was the former... he'd spend a pile of money on a dog, then throw it in the backyard on a 6' leash. By "leash" I mean 40+lb. chain. He wasn't fighting his dog, but I believe his some in his peer group did. He didn't know a 6', 40lb. chain was not a good life for a 10-month-old dog.

Other people are worse. They know the reputation, and buy so they'll look like badasses. They train them poorly or not at all, or train them to be attack dogs. Just makes me sick... a dog is a best friend, not a status symbol.

Lola said...

I absolutely agree. The worst thing that can happen to any breed is to become a popular status symbol. You then have people who have no business owning ANY dog creating the worst possible situation.

Chaining and not neutering are 2 of the biggest predictors (amongst ALL breeds) as to whether a dog will bite someone.

plrtz glrb said...

I have tried not to comment but people like you terrify me. I see the photo above as a 'before' photo, with the 'after' on the news after the child has been attacked. sure all dogs can attack but they don't all cause damage like pits. just ... scared.

astrogirl said...

I know plenty about dogs, especially the bulldog breeds and I think Lola has been informative and helpful, and without bias.

Alicia said...

I'm happy to see the pitbull love on this thread .. Some other thread a few weeks ago mentioned pits in a negative manner and when I defended them, the rest of the thread became a combative barrage of pit horror stories. I chose not to further comment on that thread out of respect although it was difficult to do so. There's nothing new I can add to this thread, but I just wanted to comment my appreciation for the intelligent, well thought out comments here. Even those for the most part who are opposed to pits or on the fence are not bashing. Keep it classy CDNAers :)

NaNa LaLa said...

I am scared of pits. :(

I really wish that I wasn't. But, I always have been. My husband is afraid of Dobermans. He loves pitbulls as he had them as a kid, but Dobermans freak him out. I would be upset if someone had my child around a dog I didn't know, but considering this is Kate, she definitely knew and chose to use it to keep her name in the news.

Jennivo69 said...

Seems to me she was fully aware of the situation and decided it was best to act worried once the public knew.

plrtz glrb said...

Gem has posted 11. times in this thread and uses ridiculous flame words in response to anyone who disagrees, intelligently and respectfully I might add, with the assertion that pitbulls are harmless ans can be safely left with children. is that trolling? Or bullying?

mizzoutiger76 said...

I have never had problems with bigger dogs when out running, it's the little ones that you have to be careful about. Had one bite me on the heel when I passed it's house. Carry pepper spray now and have almost had to spray a couple of small dogs because they were so aggressive.

Evan Thomas said...

The problem with pit bills is when you go to a breeder there can be A LOT of inbreeding. And just like if you had a kid with your brother/sister/mom/dad (super gross) there is a huge potential for mental issues, same goes for pits. That plus an irresponsible owner can really do the trick. That's why sometimes it looks like the animal "snapped". My family lost a dog to a pit but we did our research and decided to stop fearing them. My patents have 2, my brother has 1, and my husband and I have 1 we will never own anything else. Pits have crazy amounts of pressure in their jaws something like 1000lbs per sq in. (dont quote me on that just a crazy guess) all in all wonderful dogs. My friend has a 6 month old and my girl LOVES the baby gets so excited when he comes over. Nothing but kisses and giggles from those 2.

Jolene Jolene said...

I understand that people are fiercely protective of pitbulls and their reputation. Some owners are absolutely AWFUL, and while there are many aggressive pits due to the bad owners, I'm certain there are many very sweet, good-natured pitbulls as well. However, I think what a lot of people are saying is that while small dogs like Yorkies, Dachshunds, Chihuahaus etc. are just as likely to be yappy and bite you, the odds of them killing you or a child with that bite are quite low (not impossible but low). Pitbulls and other larger dogs with stronger jaws ARE capable of that depending on the attack. If someone can disagree with that with actual facts, I would love to hear it. I hate that pits are demonized, but I also can't blame people for being more afraid of them than other breeds.

jax said...

I still scars on my face from being attacked by a fucking weiner dog when I was 3!

Pitt Bulls might not be any more dangerous, but the point most of you are missing is the amount of damage a pitt bull can cause when it DOES attack. A toddler had half her neck ripped off by "the loving family dog" that attacked for no reason. None.

elizabeth said...

There is a reason people get worked up in defense of the pits. There is a TON of misinformation and fear-based mis-reporting that occurs that has caused otherwise reasonable people and dog lovers to believe pitbulls are some otherworldly beast and not just a breed of dog. And to those of us who have known great pits, it's very sad. As I see it, there are two main things that contribute to the perception of pits as being dangerous:

1. Pits ARE en vogue among irresponsible dog owners (ahem, Michael Vick). Unscrupulous people DO take these dogs in and train them horribly, making it a reality that there are very badly raised pits, through no fault of their own.

2. The media over-reports pitbull related stories. I don't have the time to go into all the statistics on this but it is an absolute fact, confirmed by journalists and veterinarians alike, that putting "pitbull" in a headline gets clicks (hey everyone on this thread! :) and stories about dog attacks by other dogs are not as sexy. That being said, see point #1 about there being some actual reality to confirm this perception.

However, and I cannot state this enough, THEY ARE AMAZING DOGS and biologically, their jaws are no different from other dog breeds' jaws (they function the same way, do not lock), and indeed, they are exceptionally loyal and receptive to training by their owners: both good training and bad training.

There is nothing whatsoever intrinsically different between pits and other when it comes to temperament or wiring. There is an organization that has done temperament training of different dog breeds and generally pits rate on the "agression" scale right around Golden Retrievers: atts.org.

As a final note, two of the sources I've seen cited here are known anti-pit propaganda sites (dogbitelaw and "truthaboutpitbulls").

But to each their own. I just know my rescued pit is honestly a gift. He has made me a better person and shown love and trust like I've never seen from another dog, and I'd hate for others to miss out on this joy because of misinformation.

elizabeth said...

Ha, sorry for the essay. Didn't realize how much I typed there. :)

Lola said...

Elizabeth, one of the links is me and it's why I said to disregard the site itself. The study I said to click on is one of the same studies the CDC uses to compile dog bite data and the other is a study used by the American Humane Assoc., both are unbiased...I took pains to find studies that were.

And you are right, Pits' jaws do not "lock" per se. But, like other bulldog types their drive is such that they do not let go...they try to hold on until whatever they are holding onto is not longer attached. They are also "biologically different" from other dogs in the force of their bite (a Pit's psi FAR exceeds say, a lab).

And there is something intrinsically different in wiring between breeds. It is the reason an Australian Shepard will attempt to herd things even in the absence of training; breeds have been bred for different purposes and Pitbulls come from breeds that were bred originally for bullbaiting and later for dog fighting. It is a fact (yes, a fact) of their breeding, as much as herding is a fact of Aussies'.

I reiterate (since it seems to be something most seem to be skipping), I am NOT saying Pits can't be great dogs. I'm not saying they can't be good with children. What I am saying is that there is a problem within the Pit population; one which many in the Pit community don't want to acknowledge (everyone likes to talk about the Vick dogs which were rehabilitated and placed but no one wants to be reminded that several were put down and several others were ordered to live out their lives in rescue facilities because they were deemed too unpredictable to ever be adopted out). Breed specific legislation is not the solution but neither is sticking your head in the sand and pretending a problem doesn't exist. Until the problem is confronted, and dealt with, public perception will not change.

elizabeth said...

Thanks for the comment, Lola. I didn't mean to pick on you in particular, and I definitely don't mean to state that there are no differences between pits and other dogs. As for the breeding for bull baiting, yes, that's definitely the case. They were also bred to be gentle toward people handling them, though, which is a key distinction that people seem gloss over. They certainly can be animal-aggressive. Mine happens to be a softie around both people and dogs, but many, many dogs can be nasty with other dogs. Pits are certainly susceptible to it. My comment about the "wiring" wasn't geared toward that aspect, but to the other thing I hear commonly that "they just snap". There is no way whatsoever to substantiate that. With the Vick dogs, only four (of 51) were put down, and a number were unable to be placed in regular homes. But that is a very extreme case: Those dogs were horrifically abused and trained to fight. That even one of them was able to recover is astonishing to me, let alone dozens.

As for the PSI thing, I've read both that there is no accurate way to gauge bite pressure, as well as rankings based on breed of bite pressure (like this one http://www.ehow.com/list_6519877_strongest-dog-bites.html which indicates a pit would be about half as forceful as a mastiff), and all I can say is I'm sure their bites have a lot of force. But I'm not sure that there is substantial data that backs your claim that their jaw strength is significantly different than another dog around the same size. Still, though, I'm totally okay with conceding this to you. They are strong. How likely they are to turn those jaws on someone is where I might differ.

Anyway, I'm sincere when I say I have an open mind to this subject. I don't know specifically what the problem you refer to that pit owners won't acknowledge is, but sociologically there are a ton of factors (backyard breeding, abuse, etc) that contribute to real behavioral issues with pits. My point is that it's not really "pit bulls are dangerous dogs, period". It's a lot more nuanced than that. Anyway, apologies if you thought I was attacking you -- wasn't my intent!

katsm0711 said...

Is this a fair conclusion? Assuming all owners are KIND and responsible, all dogs can bite a person, it's just with larger, more muscular dogs the potential to kill is greater? I feel like small yappy dogs especially terriors bite way more often but it's not a big deal, and large "scary" dogs might bite once, but it's like all the bites from a little dog combined into one horrific bite.

elizabeth said...

I think that conclusion would be very hard for a logical person to dispute. Just like getting hit by a car is more likely to mess your business up than getting hit by a bike. I probably just made physicists everywhere cry with that simplification, but you know what I mean. :)

The bottom line is one is very, very statistically unlikely to be killed by a dog. You're more likely to be killed by a big dog than a small dog, and more likely to be killed by a badly raised dog than a well raised dog. As for the predisposition of any given dog to do non-lethal damage, that's a whole 'nother deal, and one far too complicated for someone like me who watches too much Real Housewives to debate eloquently.

Jen-Again said...

I have two words for you:

Darla Napora.

She LOVED her pitties, belonged to BadRap which is a Pitbull 'defense' group that also states pits are sweet and loving and it is the owner and not the dog. Never had a problem with her dogs, neighbors all say they were well behaved and followed her commands. They slept with her and her husband. And then one of them killed her and her unborn child.

BadRap initially had people posting online trying to say that a fall from a ladder killed her and the dog was just protecting her. Nope- autopsy on her and necropsy on dog proved the dog mauled her to death. Yeah, sure, I want one of those.

elizabeth said...

You don't need to want one of those. I am very familiar with the story and live in the Bay Area where it happened. It is a horrible story. My point is that these stories are covered in depth because they are sensational; that coverage does not make them the norm, or likely.

If you can find me statistics you are comfortable with about what percentage of pitbulls who kill people, or how likely this is to happen to any given person, I am happy to discuss this with you. (I'll start: on average, we're talking about .0004% of deaths annually in the US and .0027% of all pitbulls in the US). I have not once said that it can't happen or never has. I am simply stating that preying on people's fear distorts our perception of reality. I acknowledge that some people won't believe a word I say because they genuinely believe my dog is going to kill me at any moment, or only won't if I get super lucky. Statistics just are not on those people's side.