Thursday, February 22, 2018

Blind Item #6

This group of producers told a reporter off the record they would never allow a black man to be the star of their long running franchise. 

105 comments:

Florin said...

Bond producers?

Tricia13 said...

James Bond

Sara, Making It Work said...

James Bond

sorry Idris fans!

Tricia13 said...

Eon Productions-Barbara Broccoli took over for her dad o think

totaji said...

Rich white people are still racist.

Florin said...

Snuck in before Tricia! Yeah!

Vessimede Barstool said...

Yeah it's racist to have a fictional white character portrayed only by a white actor. Just like it would be racist to have say, Black Panther, only be portrayed by a black actor......oh wait!

Tricia13 said...

๐Ÿ˜œ๐Ÿธon me!
Shaken,not stirred lol๐Ÿ˜‰

Brayson87 said...

James Bond, referencing Idris Elba potentially being cast.

Well that explains why there hasn't been a good Bond movie since GoldenEye, you've got a couple of morons at the wheel.

As if a blonde Bond was true to the source material.

DDonna Tarttty said...

Bond. That doesn't bother me and it's not racist. Bond was a white guy in the books, he's a British icon, he shouldn't be black any more than Shaft should be white (even though he actually was in first novel, believe it or not).

There are fictional icons across all races, that should be encouraged. Things that should be discouraged are casting white actors like Warner Oland and Sidney Toler as Charlie Chan.

I'd be happy to see a spy thriller with a charismatic black lead, the same way I saw "Atomic Blond" (though it was a little too cold for me to enjoy, as well made as it was), but we don't need a "Jane Bond" reboot of the EON franchise, either.

This shouldn't be controversial.

Do Tell said...

They likely won't be making Bond a woman, Hispanic or Asian, either. Just create other characters and franchises.

Florin said...

@Brayson87 - I may have to fight you over saying Casino Royal wasn't a good Bond movie.

Do Tell said...

I thought the first Bond movie with Daniel Craig (Casino Royale?) was actually pretty good. And I don't normally go to those movies.

totaji said...

ITT: Bond purists pointing out the microdetails that make this not racist but character accuracy.

Bend3r said...

I think Idris was the best choice a few years ago, but he is too old now. He would be a brief Bond. Now it's Hiddleston's time. It's been a while since the Hiddleswift fiasco and he is perfect for the role.

Aunty said...

I like my James Bond to have lips so Hiddleston is out. I vote for Jamie Dornan. He would leave us shaken AND stirred.

Donald Cox said...

Sex and The City producers

Bend3r said...

@Brayson87 I'm not a huge fan of Craig as Bond, but Casino Royale was one of the best movies of the franchise.

Donald Cox said...

Godzilla producers

Donald Cox said...

Producers of the Madea movies

Brayson87 said...

I'm not saying Casino Royale was bad, but it's not up there with the good ones.
What do you remember about that movie? People running, poker game with a bloody eye, balls being smashed. And Mads Mikkelsen was carrying half of those scenes.

J said...

Replacing Kim Cattrall?

Do Tell said...

I remember it was the first time the franchise let Bond have flaws and make mistakes, which made him infinitely more interesting and made it a much better movie, IMO.

Donald Cox said...

Whoever produces the Woody Allen franchise. I've read an internet theory that all the Woodys share an inherited code name too

Donald Cox said...

@J +1

Donald Cox said...

Much more likely there'll be a poc Bond after the opening weekend Black Panther had

Sign Name Below said...

Idris Elba and Clive Owen make me sad. Such charisma and talent and they never found the right vehicle outside their signature tv role.

Do Tell said...

I don't think it will happen. There would be a woman Bond before there would be a poc Bond, and there won't be a woman Bond either.

B said...

Idris is perfect for Bond. What a shame

Urban reader said...

Goran Visnjic would be a great bond! Still early forties.

Donald Cox said...

I don't think there'll necessarily be a woman Bond as misogyny is a core part of the character, but producers everywhere are gonna be chasing that Wakanda money in the next few years

Do Tell said...

Why don't they just make a secondary character that Bond occasionally works with, another agent, that shows up in films with him? It doesn't have to be Bond. Could even make it a double agent, and if popular enough, there's a spinoff.

Donald Cox said...

Although the producers said "black man" so they havent ruled out a black lady Bond then

@Do Tell - weren't they trying that with Halle Berry's character?

A Black Widow movie might beat them to all the plot beats

Do Tell said...

Yes, Bond himself is misogynist, but they have had some very strong female characters in the movie, M for one. The Bond movies usually do pretty well, I don't think the producers will ever feel that they have to radically change the character.

Nonya Bidness said...

That's sad. Agree with the comment that Daniel Craig did not fit the physical type of any of the other Bonds, being blond and more muscular.

The Broccolis can suck it. That franchise should be put out of its misery - its glory days are gone.

Donald Cox said...

The complaints about Craig's physicality seemed daft to me, given Roger Moore in A View To A Kill and the original Casino Royale Bonds.

The first Bond was played by the legendary Bob Holness but men like that simply don't exist any more

Donald Cox said...

Ah crap google just said he played the second Bond

Bend3r said...

Bond wasn't Scottish, Fleming made him Scottish because of Sean Connery. It wouldn't be the first time the character background is adjusted because of the actor who is portraying him. Also, the character started in the middle of the cold war era, but in Casino Royale he acquires his 00 status in the modern era, so the franchise has already been rebooted and the background of the character changed deeply. I don't think a black actor would change the nature of the character, an actress would be more problematic since the character relies on certain things like being a womanizer as personality traits, but I would love to see Gal Gadot casted as a Bond Girl and have her own franchise as a Mossad agent with Bond helping to launch her first movie with his presence. Not happening since everything related to the middle east would be extremely controversial and damaging in too many markets, but I'd love to. They could do the same with a CIA agent, though (Nathalie Emmanuel would be my choice).

Scandi Sanskrit said...

And the very special Bond girl (Vesper).

Inflatable said...

So you are telling me that I am supposed to buy that a Scottish man, an Englishman, An Irishman and a friggin Australian can play this role but not an black man. Absurd and typical swept-under-the-carpet kind of racism.

one_eyed_bob said...

Since this blind touches on race and movie roles, I thought I'd share this thought: Why is it the "Black Panther" but then the other characters are just "Thor" and "The Hulk" etc. It's not "White Captain America" or "The Green Hulk." Why not just have Boseman's character be "The Panther"? Just curious.

(dislaimers: 1. I am not african american 2. i realize that was the name of the comic book character but still)

Normal. Yes indeed. said...

Mads is one hell of a performer. I love how he utilizes his body to develop the characters. I think he was a trained dancer.

amused bush said...

One_eyed_bob, he was coined Black Panther to denote he was a black superhero. Remember, he was created during he 60’s and at that time, the default for comic book heroes was white, so it would make sense that a specifically black character would be denoted as such. Not saying it is right or wrong, but the name is representative of the era the character was created.

Too bad about Idris, he really would have made a great Bond. Alas, he is now too old. I think an actor like Will Yun Lee would make a great Bond, but he might be too old as well.

Low Key said...

Marvel also has Black Bolt, who is white... so there's that.

David Howes said...

Sad to read this racist item.

I think the Bond character could be played by anyone -- even a woman!

Jen Ty said...

Tom Hardy is the current bookie fav on Bond but I think a franchise movie is for an actor who has nothing else going on you know - Hardy is attached to more interesting projects than he can possibly get to over the next 5 - 10 years.

Jen Ty said...

Unless of course Christopher Nolan gets handed the franchise which is rumoured

Rafael said...

They sound like Trump supporters. Disgusting human beings...

Cadmium77 said...

Bend3r said...
Bond wasn't Scottish, Fleming made him Scottish because of Sean Connery. It wouldn't be the first time the character background is adjusted because of the actor who is portraying him. Also, the character started in the middle of the cold war era, but in Casino Royale he acquires his 00 status in the modern era, so the franchise has already been rebooted and the background of the character changed deeply. I don't think a black actor would change the nature of the character, an actress would be more problematic since the character relies on certain things like being a womanizer as personality traits, but I would love to see Gal Gadot casted as a Bond Girl and have her own franchise as a Mossad agent with Bond helping to launch her first movie with his presence. Not happening since everything related to the middle east would be extremely controversial and damaging in too many markets, but I'd love to. They could do the same with a CIA agent, though (Nathalie Emmanuel would be my choice).

8:51 AM

hmmm a spy series with a female mossad agent. i don't go to movies anymore but i'd pay good money to see the episode where mossad stages 911.

Bradford said...

The Bachelor

FancyFel said...

@one eye
also, it's interesting to note the characteristics of a literal black panther. When backed into a corner, it will go left or right to avoid the oppressor, but if kept pressed, it will attack the oppressor. That is part of why the organization adopted it as an icon, because it wants peace first. That may be another reason to refer to the character as Black Panther to retain the essence of the origin story.
I HIGHLY recommend searching the podcast : stuff you should know + black panther episode. It is very informative, interesting and entertaining account of the black panther movement. Just 2 white guys that just looks stuff and enjoyably banter about what they found on a subject.

AngryLiberalKTS. said...

+1

nancer said...

idris elba would be the hottest bond since sean connery in his prime. shit, i might even go see it if they did that.

LeahBryar said...

I don't think Bond being white is racist.
It's an iconic book character.
Will Anne of Green Gables be black?
Or Black Beauty be a Palamino

Do Tell said...

The family/heirs of Ian Fleming, if there are any left, have every right to preserve the image of the character of Bond as Fleming saw fit to create it. I'm wondering if Fleming had it written into his contracts that Bond would stay very close to the physical embodiment as he wrote it. A hair color change or a change in his accent from British to Scottish isn't that much of a change.

Do Tell said...

FFS at the 9/11 conspiracy theory.

FancyFel said...

Ummm, there was a little production named Hamilton that proves you dont have to chain yourself to the restraints of precedent of race, ethnicity, and if you watched the Drunk History Hamilton episode, gender either (the drunk history episode of Hamilton was great!)

T. W. said...

To all the people saying Bond was white in the books:

What do you have to say about the recent films based on books which have non-white characters but the movie producers cast white actors such as Scarlett Johansson?

Mem said...

Can one of the people here saying this is racist explain what's racist about it please? I don't get it.

It's a specific character. They're not saying "we're against any spy films starring black men". I like Idris Elba as much as the next guy, and I'm sure he would've been good in the role a few years ago. Personally I don't care about "staying true to the book character" or whatever. But it's still pretty damn pathetic to condemn them for doing that.

Do you think it's racist that every Clark Kent and Bruce Wayne has been white? In your minds, is the only fair thing to do have every long-running fictional character rotate through white, black, East Asian, Indian, Native American, etc. actors? And like one in every 10 must be trans?

That's something interesting to think about actually. No one complains about there being no Asian James Bond. He's a British character, there are a lot more Asians than black people in the UK, so if it's about representation why isn't that your priority? If I was as self-righteous as the people calling this "racist", I'd say THEY were disgustingly racist against Indians. But I'm not, so I'll just blame it on ignorance instead.

Bend3r said...

@T. W. Sure, many people who justified Scarlett Johansson in Ghost in the Shell will whine about a black Bond, but I think even more people outraged by Ghost in the Shell will justify a black Bond. Personally, if the changes doesn't alter dramatically the nature of the character I'm OK. It annoys me when they are historical figures (BBC does this a lot), but with fictional characters, as soon as they keep certain essence, go ahead. I am more annoyed with Bond being a gym rat and the movies being sometimes a bit of a Michael Bay-ish explosion fest than him being blonde or portrayed by an Australian actor (or black). Besides, Timothy Dalton is considered the closest to Fleming's depiction and a mediocre at best Bond (more because of the quality of the movies than his fault, IMO).

But again, for me the issue with Idris Elba is the age. After Quantum I would have choose him without hesitation, but now... changing the actor to choose someone that old will leave you with the same problem after 2-3 movies (still better choice than Dornan, Hardy or Cumberbatch, though). Hiddleston has amazing talent (Shakespearian thespian caliber as he has shown in The Shallow Crown or Coriolanus in National Theatre Live), charm, style, presence and after watching him in The Night Manager is hard to think he wouldn't be a great Bond if they give him decent material.

@Do Tell Not a single post in CDaN without its batshit crazy conspiranoid comment.

Kno Won Uno said...

+1
Idris Elba is perfect for the role if only he didn’t have all that melanin๐Ÿ™„

Kno Won Uno said...

Yeah.
It’s Woody.

Kno Won Uno said...

There’s a woman colonel repping KFC๐Ÿ™„

Kno Won Uno said...

(I predict responses like “all widows matter”)

FancyFel said...

@mem
Let me say I don't think your wrong, it could be ignorance, laziness or narrow mindness. But the blind said they will never allow a black person to play the lead.
That feels like they are saying a person of a different race (Indian, Asian, etc) is automatically disqualified to play in an iconic role because they aren't the right color.
I think the counter argument is 'hey, if you just took the time to look, and judge performance, we think there is a wider pool of options to consider if you are interested in finding the best Bond. '

So to answer your question, it's racist when decisions seem to be solely based on race. Which may seem fine to some people but it doesn't seem fair to others to be disqualified on a mis-informed assumption. And that's the rub.

Danilo mรผller said...

Oh wait, racism against whites does not exist! Were not the blacks the protagonists of any existing film and you really want to compare the two? zzZzZ

Kno Won Uno said...

There is no “but still”
It’s the name of the character.
Jesus.

Kno Won Uno said...

I heartily concur!

Kno Won Uno said...

::::crickets::::::

Kno Won Uno said...

+1000

Normal. Yes indeed. said...

Everyone is in agreement CR is the best bond movie.

Why did the Broccoli family decide to go the Blofeld route again? All the Blofeld bond movies are way over the top except for Spectre. The train fight was the only good thing. Never saw James Bond run from the henchman before with fear in his eyes.

Bosh90 said...

Could be Dr. Who..

T. W. said...

@totaji - your comment made me think of "white purists." Doesn't Ghost in the Shell have an Asian character but a white woman (ScarJo) is portraying her in the film version?

T. W. said...

@Donald Cox - black people spend cash money, plus we are tired of being portrayed in a negative light.

@ Kno Won Uno - Yes, that is Reba McIntyre. I know KFC had better not hire a black actor as Colonel Sanders. Don't get me started on that stereotype...

T. W. said...

@one_eyed_boob - Stan Lee puposefully intended to create a black comic book hero. Black Panther makes perfect sense because of the Black Panther party. If you are not familiar with them, be careful in your research. The government put out false information, calling them violent and militant.

T. W. said...

@Kno Won Uno - EXACTLY

These Bond not being black is not racist arguments have no leg to stand on.

T. W. said...

@Mem - James Bond being white is not the issue. The producers of the film and their argument is racist.

The Bond films have not stayed true to the books so why can't they have a female or a non-white actor portray James Bond?

Let me put it this way. Suppose the African Nation of Wakanda secured all rights to the books. They want to make a film. Which is easier, hire an all black cast because they are competent, they are available, and they are already in country or should stay true to the book and hire all white actors.

On othet words, race was never an issue until the producers made it an issue.

T. W. said...

@Bend3r - Thank you!

For me, race was not an issue until the producers made it an issue.

Mem said...

@FancyFel
I agree with that counter-argument, it's always better to be open-minded (although I don't really care about Bond - maybe if I was a lifelong fan of the books and movies I'd have more of an opinion and be narrow-minded myself). I just think calling it racism is a massively overblown reaction. No one's entitled to have a specific character changed to look like them. Especially one that's been around for 60+ years. It's nothing to be outraged about. A more appropriate reaction is "that's a shame, they're missing a good opportunity there".
The part about it being unfair, I dunno...Obviously the Black Panther example someone used upthread was a bad comparison, because Black Panther's blackness is inherent to the character in a way that Bond's whiteness isn't, BUT that is just how casting works isn't it? You don't send out a casting call for a character "any age, any build, any sex, any ethnicity, any accent", you narrow it down, you have something in mind. In this case, they're set on keeping Bond white, as he has been for the entire half-century-plus long history of the franchise.

The real answer is, someone should've seen all the hype for Idris Elba as Bond years ago and produced a new action spy property for him. Would've been a guaranteed success. Could have even been a spin-off kinda thing, just give him a different double-0 number and a new story.

Mem said...

@T.W., if an African nation had the rights and made the film, then it would be up to them. If they made all the characters black, fine, that's how they want to adapt it. If they want to have a white guy, also fine. Neither of those would offend me. That would be their choice, just as it's currently these producers' choice.

I disagree that the producers made race an issue. I doubt they'd ever really thought about it, until campaigning fans made it an issue. The reporter presumably asked them about it, off-the-record, and they responded...

I see what you're saying though, the wording of the blind "never allow" sounds bad. If the reporter asked "would you consider having a black Bond?" and they literally said the words "No we would never allow that to happen", that sounds a lot more damning than if they just said "No, Bond's a white dude". Like the rights-holders to Agatha Christie's books, if you ask them if they'd have a black or female Poirot, they'd probably be confused and say "What? No, he's a white Belgian with a big moustache". Nothing wrong with that, but if they said "We would never allow a black person to be Poirot"...it sounds sinister.
I guess it's hard to say how racist they are without knowing the actual conversation.

FancyFel said...

... no one is entitled to have a character look like them.
Correct, the argument is: it's not about the right to do something... it's about the reason.
Sure it's your right. But Intentional or not, if a decision that disadvantages someone is made on factors beyond their control, it's an 'ism'. She can't do the job because it require math, he can't drive box office numbers because he's black, the musical won't make money because it's an all minority cast about history. You can't, you can't you can't because of who you are.
If someone has not experienced that narrative, that is the definition of privilege. Racism is not over blown if its true. It is what it is.

I have enjoyed this thread.

MattDaddy said...

Bond. They’ve run through the original material and rebooted the franchise, they could take it in any direction they wanted so it’s not some grand artistic desire to stay true to the source material.

emeraldcity said...

Pointless arguments really, Bond is, always has been and was conceived by the author as white, poltical correctness is not going to change that.

Think outside the outrage box and look at other options, Bond is 007 which means there are plenty of other 00's who could be made Black or Female , introduce a new 00 in the next James Bond movie and then let them have their own franchise if the character becomes popular. Problem solved. I really think the producers are missing out on a very profitable option having closed minds about this. After all Halley Berry's Jinx character was being talked about as a new franchise but never got past the chatter, I for one would have really liked to have seen more Jinx movies.

Do Tell said...


"no one is entitled to have a character look like them."

People who existed in real life certainly are.


I am never going to see casting an actual historical figure, who existed in real life, against their actual race as anything but a incredibly bad, stupid idea, in every case (aside from sketch comedy) that I have seen or heard of. Yes, Ben Kingsley could probably be a passable and very good George Washington Carver in a biopic, but they shouldn't do it. Nor should they cast John Goodman as Martin Luther King Jr or Denzel W. as Abraham Lincoln. Just no, in every case.

atd8vii said...

I’m not against Elba playing Bond but I don’t at all care if the producers only want a white actor playing the character.

atd8vii said...

As on the nose as you can get.

tetsujin said...

If you read up on the history of the franchise, film and book, you'll find loads of racism, casual and otherwise. I think it's one of the reasons Elba asked people to stop talking about it, not that all the talk would make it happen, but that they were wasting their breath.

It's kind of sad, or maybe just dopey, to try and justify arguing that there's no racism behind saying that Bond -- if it is Bond -- will never be portrayed by a Black man.

atd8vii said...

There’s nothing wrong with the character remaining white. Don’t let anyone tell you that you’re a racist for thinking otherwise.

And do people honestly think that having a black actor play James Bond is accomplishing any kind of social progression? If anything it’d just come across as a cheap gimmick much like the new Ghostbusters movie.

Aoife said...

No one here remembers that the people in charge of the Bond franchise didn't want Sean Connery because he was Scottish?! Connery talked about it himself.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/66876/Sean-Connery-Snob-Ian-Fleming-didn-t-want-me-to-play-Bond

I agree with whoever said a vehicle could've/should've been produced with Idiris as an international man of intrigue.

jessorella said...

I have been fully on board with the idea of Idris being Bond for several years, and that has everything to do with his cachet as an actor and the fact that he'd be amazing in the role. I don't think he's old enough, and he is still incredibly fit (search for his documentary about training to be a boxer). People who say he, or any other black actor, couldn't play the role because "Bond was never black" are likely the same people who got up in arms about the fact that the role of Hermione in HP and the Cursed Child went to an extremely talented black actress. The producers are effectively throwing a huge box-office return in the bin by refusing to consider him based on the colour of his skin.

Scandi Sanskrit said...

HOw can you say Idris is not old enough? He was old enough to play a father figure in "Pacific Rim", he was born 1972 and he looked old enough to be a 007 in early episodes of "Luther" (and that was years ago).

That's 9 years older than Thomas Hiddleston (who although I was fine with as Jonathan Pine doesn't look mature enough for 007—I love Thomas, but I've got to be honest, it's true).

jessorella said...

Gah, I meant he's not TOO old (as some people said earlier on)! Mea culpa.

Scandi Sanskrit said...

Oops, Jessorella. I should've known it was a typing mistake.

Today's been full of miscommunications for me too (I've been misunderstood at least once today). Sometimes the Universes act wonky like this with all the squares in the air.

jessorella said...

@Scandi Pergaps Mercury is in retrograde ๐Ÿค”

jessorella said...

PERHAPS. Bloody phone.

Scandi Sanskrit said...

No. Something more temporary than that (it should/hopefully be over by Sunday). Not a good time for double entendres (people will take it the most wrong way).

Bend3r said...

It's not that Idris Elba is too old to portrait Bond right now, he still can. But he is 45 and it takes about three years to complete a Bond movie, that means that after wrapping up his third movie in the franchise he will be in his mid fifties (half a decade older than Daniel Craig now), and that's too old to be in an action movie. Besides, a new actor will likely imply a reboot, and the portrayal of a younger Bond.

I still think it would be better a short stint of a good Bond (like Elba) rather than a long stint of a bad Bond (like Dornan, Hardy, Aidan Turner or, God forbids it, Cumberbatch or Cillian Murphy).

Scandi Sanskrit said...

Ugh. No. To me Benedick Cumberbatch (and Cillian Murphy, based on Googling him) look more like Bond villain material. And I'm not saying that like it's a bad thing.

I could totally relate to the Bond villain in "Spectre" whose father/parents played altruistic and took in an orphan only to emotionally neglect his own son.

Bend3r said...

@Aoife Yes, Bond was an icon of England (not UK) and they didn't want a Scottish to portray him. Connery did great and Fleming made the character Scottish as a tribute. Fleming also changed Bond's Beretta 418 (.25) for a Walter PPK (.32) because of a gun expert, Geoffrey Boothroyd, told him that the Beretta was a good choice... for a lady's purse (as well as other gun-related mistakes Fleming made). The Q that gives Bond the Walter PPK is named Major Boothroyd after him and was introduced as 'the greatest small arms expert in the world'.

@Scandi Sanskrit I thought the same, they are both good choices as villains or maybe as Qs, but they would be awful Bonds, nothing bad with them, it would be just a miscast. Cristoph Waltz was a great villain (and Mads Mikkelsen). He was great in Carnage too.

@T.W. I've read this days that the character of Black Panther came before the party, and that they even change its name briefly because of the association.

Scandi Sanskrit said...

Yeah I love Uncle Mads as a Bond villain. Something about the putting on eyedrops makes made him weirdly interesting to me. IDK. ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ‘

The Truth said...

Bore off barstool

The Truth said...

Idris is as British (or London) as they come. Bond wasnt a short ugly blond bloke either but I’m sure you didnt mind that. He also wasnt in action in 2018!

MovieBuff said...

Lol we already have the black lady selling chicken for Popeyes.

Bitca said...

Unsurprising that the Broccolis might be racists. Italy has more than its fair share of ignorance, racism, bigotry, and sexism.

But how ironic! Fleming was no purist about the characters in his spy-fantasy novels. As mentioned above, he even tweaked Bond's appearance etc in later books after Connery appeared in "Dr No." The pretense of Bond being some sort of White Guy Institution is ludicrous.


As for the racists who "don't understand" why it's racist to claim that no actor of color is qualified for this particular job: if you're that set on not understanding, no point trying to enlighten you. See you in 2035, suckers ;).

Bobby Digital said...

I don’t want to see another bond film at all, regardless if it’s a white guy, black guy, tranny, it’s a played out franchise. Just get Tracye Morgan to revamp his snl character Lamont Bond and I might see it

Advertisement

Popular Posts from the last 30 days