Tiger Says Lynching Comment Is Non-Issue
**Update**The editors over at Golf For Women have set up a poll today for everyone to decide whether or not Kelly should get to keep her job. If you get a chance, click on the link and vote.
Tiger Woods saw no insult or ill will in a television commentator's comment that any golfer trying to test him might have to "lynch him in a back alley", Woods' agent said in a statement.
This story is a non-issue," Steinberg said. "Tiger and Kelly are friends and Tiger has a great deal of respect for Kelly. Regardless of the choice of words used we know unequivocally that there was no ill-intent in her comments. "This story is a non-issue in our eyes. Case closed."
Well, I'm glad Tiger is so forgiving, but I still think it was probably the worst thing an announcer has ever said on television. I'm still wondering how she has managed to keep her job. I wonder if Tiger Woods has enough power to keep her on the air despite the fact that the Golf Channel received thousands upon thousands of e-mails telling them to take her off the air.
For her part, Kelly Tilghman had this to say. "On Friday during our golf broadcast, Nick Faldo and I were discussing Tiger's dominance in the golf world and I used some poorly chosen words," she said.
"I have known Tiger for 12 years and I have apologized directly to him. I also apologize to our viewers who may have been offended by my comments."
May have been offended? She can't be serious. She acts like most of the people are on her side and the ones who found it offensive are heavily outnumbered.
83 comments:
Come on, I love this blog and post now and again even though I read every day, and I even hate those haters who post bullcrap, but when did we become a country with no sense of humor where we have to watch everything we say because someone might be offended. I am Mexican and have to hear all the immigration comments on a daily basis from EVERYONE, yet I don't feel offended. Yes, it hurts me but I get over it because every body is entitled to their opinions. Again, I love this site and the way ENT writes, you're really funny, but I think the fact that we can't say anything without someone bitching about it is trully sad.
Jenny, what you say makes sense. I just think as long as we're in this 'off with their heads' mode, that she shouldn't be treated any differently than others who misspoke before her.
It IS a shame that we walk on eggshells with certain groups. You can't say anything about a ton of people, but you can say tons about people who are overweight, or Catholics or Italians. Then, anything goes.
i love you man but you're beating a dead horse.
if tiger himself says its a non-issue then why do i care?
I think you need to revisit your own post about our new PC world.
ya i'm spunky today too! lol.
It's a complicated issue. I agree that we overreact to these situations, but we need to continue to say that some kinds of speech cross the line. I'd rather see people who say ignorant things be made to participate in some kind of forum to educate themselves and others instead of being fired.
IMHO, there shouldn't be a double standard employed here.
If the comment were made by a male talking head, you can rest assured that he'd be out the door so fast his microphone would still be warm.
However she's getting a pass because she's a woman?
Fire her.
Gender doesn't excuse stupidity.
Also, I think this is only a tiny bit about Tiger. It's mostly about whether it's ever okay to suggest that racially-motivated violence is acceptable.
Fire the Ignorant Biotch! Tiger isn't upset cuz they're "friends"...hmmm
I don't understand how she suggested "racially motivated violence". I kept my mouth shut yesterday, but I think I'll chime in here. Contrary to popular opinion, the word "lynch" does NOT mean "to hang a person of color". I have used the word "lynch" in common speech before, many times. And never once did it have to do with race. I have mentioned "lynching my ex husband" because the word "lynch" sounds cooler to me than "I'm gonna kick his ass", which is just overplayed. No, I am not black, and neither is my ex husband. Maybe she should have thought ahead - "okay , since he's black, what words *can't* I use?" But that's even worse to me.
An unfortunate choice of words, yes. A racially motivated attack? Not even. The worst thing an announcer has ever said on television? Mmmmm nope. I love you Ent, but I'll have to disagree with you on this one.
And since they've known each other, on friendly terms no less, and he's dismissive about this issue, we should probably just LET IT GO....
lynch /lɪntʃ/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[linch] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–verb (used with object) to put to death, esp. by hanging, by mob action and without legal authority.
[Origin: 1825–35, Americanism; v. use of lynch in lynch law]
****
from dictionary.com
I don't see anywhere the mention of the person's color.
wow...Kim is ignorant also....
Wait, people....honestly? You can't see how "lynching" could be considered a racially motivated attack? Are you even AWARE of what went on in this country before and during the Civil Rights movement?
Although the word "lynch" has no specification of race or skin color in it's dictionary definition, there's no arguing the imagery that is called to mind when you say "lynch someone in a back alley."
I am a HUGE fan of this site but this over-reaction is just plain stupid. If you are going to condem Kelly for her comments, maybe we should then go back and look at some of the comments that have been made in this blog - I'm sure that there have been moments when things have been written, even in jest, that caused some to take offense. Should we then shut the site down? Tiger obviously isn't offended so why should we be. Would it matter if you knew that the comments we are discussing were made by a rumored-to-be lesbian, a sector of society I know has been "lynched" here in the past? Kelly is a fantstic announcer who has apologized more than enough - can we just move along now and discuss more important topics?
Right on chatty!!! These peeps are more ignorant than Kelly T.!!!!
I'm mostly with Ent on this one. Seriousness of this supersedes Tiger being OK with her private apology.
I like what someone said yesterday about Tilghman (sp?) having to accept a demotion to a local network to give her more experience in light to this.
Oh yes, we *peeps* are ignorant because our opinions differ from yours. Hmmmm Good lord. WTF happened to free speech? let's drop the PC BS here on this blog. If you'd like to get specific, I don't recall hearing about anyone being lynched in a back alley during the Civil Rights Movement. From what I understand, it was usually done in a tree, in the woods or someone's front yard. Not a back alley. When I hear "back alley", I think abortion. Oh no! I may have offended someone by saying "abortion".
While the definition of lynch may not include race, I don't think you can say lynch without the memory of the civil rights fight coming to mind. Have you ever actually heard the lyrics for "Strange Fruit"? There's a reason for the song. And it isn't overreaction.
jesse...is that a pic of your abortion?
Ent-
Love the site, but you are way off base here. I actually saw the clip on TV this morning and this is so overblown! She said it jokingly and totally tongue in cheek. It was a total joke which was grounded in the position that Tiger is the greatest golfer and new golfers will never have a chance to beat him unless they "get em."
I realize that there are many people who have decided that they can be offended by the word lynch as a derogatory word to the African American community and if she had said it seriously, as if upset about something he did and that he "deserved to be lynched in a dark alley" or something like that, I could see the uproar.
But to say that this woman should lose her job because a poor choice for words is beyond me. And yes, the word is used in common language, such as in the word "lynchpin" and many other races and groups of people have been lynched by a mob, such as Jesus Christ, Joan of Arc, those prosecuted by the Salem Witch Trials, I could go on and on, but lynching is just not unique to African Americans in the 60's.
Of course what happened to these people was horrible and a scar on our history, but certainly doesn't give to right to a group to banish a perfectly legitimate word from the English language, unlike other illigimate words such as the N word or F word, etc...
OK-off my soap box now! Peace!
i clicked the link but all i got a was a huge banner welcoming Hilary to the club.
strange.
k, are you still reading? (probably not - every time I ask that I get nothing...lol)
spasuzy - WTF??? Was that necessary?
I'm going to piss many people off, but its not surprising that Tiger is cool with this. He has many times in the past tried to distance himself from the black community.
I'm not saying that apology wouldn't be accepted from someone within the black community, I just don't believe its something that can be swept under the rug so easily. If scientologists can be pissed off about being misrepresented on South Park, I think its fair to say that Kelly's words would rub people the wrong way.
Jenny, I'm not mexican, but I do get offended when I hear the immigration remarks because in a way its a form of modern day racism. Mexican immigrants have been here for years...why the commotion now. I'm not saying people should be rioting in the streets, but its important for some things to not fall to the wayside or even become acceptable.
But these are my opinions and of course I'm blessed to live in country that allows me to speak them and discuss them without being judged. Jesse, Chris and Kim have that right as well.
You can link directly to the poll at http://www.golfforwomen.com/magazine/polls/kelly_tilghman/golfchannel
Ice Angel, I see where ur coming from. However just because something is said jokingly doesn't mean it hurts less.And Jesus, Joan of Arc isn't a group of people...nice try though.
Can I pose this question? If someone said something about a Jewish athlete that maybe he or she should be sent to concentration camp and gassed would our opinions be the same?
spasuzy screw you. that is a pic of my beautiful newborn daughter and f*ck you very much for saying that you ignorant whore.
And what is a strangefruit? I'm just saying not everyone thinks of hanging black people when they say the word lynch. Wtf???? And until this very conversation, I was able to NOT think of the word in that context. Thanks for the *education*.
k,
I think that is where the differencing of opinions is here. I can actually say or think of the word lynch and NOT have those memories coming to mind. And no I have never heard that song, or even heard OF it as a matter of fact. Who is it by?
I think Ice Angel said it best :
"And yes, the word is used in common language, such as in the word "lynchpin" and many other races and groups of people have been lynched by a mob, such as Jesus Christ, Joan of Arc, those prosecuted by the Salem Witch Trials, I could go on and on, but lynching is just not unique to African Americans in the 60's"
Awww jesse...did I offend you??? I just wanted to point out to the peeps what an ignorant hypocrite you are. What about free speech??? What about all the PC BS in here????
Thank you for proving my point.
Jesse, she's a cutie!
jesse,
we had this same argument in yesterdays comments where I had said that I don't make that correlation when hearing the word. Just because others do, doesn't mean that everyone else does.
And Tracee is very correct here, we are all entitled to our opinions which is why you won't see me attacking anyone unlike another poster here.
See twisted...I knew I'd get a reaction from jesse...even though my post WAS brutal...
Spasuzy, when was the last time someone ripped someone PERSONALLY like that? To call someone's child an abortion is as bad as some of the filth we've seen on here by another poster. WHAT IS YOUR FUCKING POINT?
See my post at 2:13 twistid...THAT was my point.
Yeah, I saw your post. And you're WAY out of line with what you did. You're comparing apples with oranges. You personally attacked her and her baby just because she's of the opinion that it was a poor choice of words and not racially motivated. That's sick.
And you're comparing a friend of Tiger's who said something accidentally, with yourself, who went out of your way to say something grossly offensive. You really need to apologize to her.
Hmm...seems like everyone isn't into free speech as much as we thought. See how easy it is for a few words to be misconstrued?
Jesse D, I have to agree with you completely.
I use the word lynch every so often and it is NEVER a racial remark. I also agree that to see someone predominantly as a colour (either a black person or a white person, for example) and having to carefully consider everything you say in front of them, even when there was no ill-intent behind your comments, is creating more of a divide than the comment itself.
I can definitely see why people were upset. What i dont understand though, is why some people are flat out refusing to believe that she didnt mean for it to be taken as a racist and hateful remark.
twisted I'm still reading. For those who asked. "Strange Fruit" is best known as a Billie Holliday song. I'm not saying everyone who uses the word is racist. I'm saying that the connection does exist, and it's not a pretty one.
Oh, and I don't think the announcer meant it that way. The problem is that she said it and if she can't think on her feet faster than that and she's on television? Maybe she should be a print reporter. If Imus lost his job because of his remarks, why wouldn't this woman?
spasuzy- find attention elswhere and let the adults talk. you're here to start shit and nothing more. so you started shit and the rest here will indeed finish it.
now go drink your juice box and have a time out.
no jax...I was proving my point about free speech and PC BS (and sucessfully so, I may say)
k,
I agree about your Imus comment. The punishment should be the same for everyone. I am sure Imus didn't mean it the way it came out either. But you are right, as professional journalists, they need to be punished. The same as in the workplace, if you break a rule at work you get punished.
My argument was never if she was right or wrong, just that some people don't correlate that word to rasicm.
k, I left you a BIG APOLOGY on that thread where I addressed a post to you, when you weren't one of the haters. I hope you saw it, but if you didn't, I apologize for the mix up again!!! I'm old and easily confuzzled.
Wow, I've been gone for a while, but I must ask, is Spasuzy a troll, or did she used to be a cool kid? On topic, while I can believe that Kelly T. did not mean her comment in a racially motivated way, I think any time you decide to become a broadcast newsperson you are obligating yourself to think of all possible connotations of everything you say. Failure to do so has consequences. There can be no double standard.
no you're looking an immature punk biotch so don't think your perversion of free speech is impressing anyone.
if you would like to prove your point with some semblance of intelligence perhaps avoid personally attacking people for shits n giggles becasue we WILL call you out for it.
sadly we all know you are doing this for attention so going forth i'm ignoring your pathetic ass.
Tracee, I love you, but do you have your head up your ass? Tiger and the report are friends. I've read that in every article I read about it. She made a joking comment. Spasuzy and Jesse are NOT friends and the comment called her baby an abortion. You don't see the difference here? Come on, you're smarter than that.
And remember, I said she should be fired, because although I dislike this climate where we're all having to walk on eggshells (except if you're overweight, Italian or Catholic, then you're fair game), but since others before her have been fired, she too should be held to the same standards.
Or blonde ;)!
Where's the looooove guys? Spasuzy isn't a troll...been around awhile. But jesse d handled it fine! He told her to back the fuck up and she/he did. Next.
Sigh. I feel like my comments might get caught up in the Spasuzy debauchery.
I feel very badly for this girl because if she didn't know why her choice of words was so out of line at the time, she sure does now! She'll probably always have this as a footnote too. But? She said it. I'm happy that Tiger is able to call it a non-issue, but that doesn't cover others who were hurt or offended.
I am DEFINITELY NOT of the mindset that everything should be censored, but I am of the mindset that everyone needs to take responsibility for their actions and if someone says or does something offensive, they need to own up to it (which I guess one could argue she did by apologizing to Tiger).
Tracee, I think you said it best.
Yeah, Rakemama...blondes get no respect either.
Tracee, I recognize the name and won't call her a troll, but that was a sick fuck thing to say.
IMO, children should never be brought into any disagreement, ever. I'd rather you show off your freedom of speech by saying my mama wears combat boots or something like that.
Sista, no farther than your head is up yours. I didn't say it was wrong if you'll re-read. My thing is why knuckle up when Jesse took care of it. It was sick, but it was between them...let grown folks handle their biz gurl.
Thanks Chatty. Believe nobody will compare your comments with Spasuzy. Now back to the Spasuzy debacle 2008! ;)
Is it Beer:30 yet?
Tracee, I just checked and I'm not limber enough to stick my head up my ass...lol. I'm older than dirt, remember.
Rakemama, I agree...kids should be off limits.
Chatty, Tracee is right (this time...lol). You didn't say anything offensive so no problem.
great the old divide and conquer..ease up guys youre giving spaz a front row seat to CDAN dysfunction. lol
Sorry but you come here and call someones kid an abortion i'd expect people to say something.
Oh come on grandma! I put some Werther's Originals up there and so I KNOW you can reach! My head's only half-way up my ass...my back went out as I was trying to go further. :)
Agreed! Kids should be off limits, I mean their our future after all.
hot tea through the nose..not cool Tracee. LOL. werther's.
Hot Damn, this was a spicy thread.
Thanks for the read.
spasuzy - totally overboard
Tracee, put Christian Bale up there and I will find a way!
Jax, no dividing here. You know we can tell each other to fuck off and then it's over and done with.
ok fuck off*
*fuck offs to twist to be directed on Tuesday, thursday and alternating saturdays.
Hey! Save some of those fuck off's for tomorrow, will ya? And I will NOT be going into hiding like Cap did today.
Ooh, i made Jax squirt one! [fist pump] YES!
Heeehee, Sista. Too true. Can i find him locked up in your closet or do I need to find some rope to tie him up? Its true Sista and I bicker, but we don't hold grudges...I mean its a gossip site! That would be silly!
Hay...where is Captivagrl? She's lurking I can feel it! She got off easy!
Well signing off for the day. Peace out CDANers!
WTF??
Anyway... I got called away by work (hate that), and in the meantime it seems like everybody's (almost?) calmed down around here. But I'm STILL PO'ed at Ent for "stirring the pot" on this one! I know the guy's not exactly known for "understatement," but..."The worst thing an announcer has ever said on television"(??)
For THAT reason alone, I'm posting my original response:
Jesse D & Chris Y: I am soooo with you guys on this! SANITY is SO refreshing. :) ...Re: Kelly. The crazy thing is it's probably the very fact that she ISN'T racist and therefore doesn't even think in those terms that it didn't occur to her (in the micro-second that she had to think) that she was speaking of an "AFRICAN-AMERICAN MAN" when she used a word that people use ALL THE TIME in a totally non-racial context!
All a B.S.-reaction like this does is teach people who actually ARE "color-blind" that they SHOULDN'T BE! Noooo...Instead, they should ALWAYS think of people in terms of their race, and be HYPER-VIGILANT of every (perfectly innocent) syllable they utter around them! Seriously.. How does it HELP race relations to crucify a person who CLEARLY wasn't thinking in terms of race when she used the word?
Uh-OH.... Did I just say "CRUCIFY"?! :0 ...Now, does that make me a Christian-Basher or an Anti-Semite? Hmmm. I'm sure the P.C. police will be happy to let me know.
SICK Tracee!
Those who do not make the correlation between the word lynch and racial violence are ill-informed, uneducated and like Chatty said, AWARE of what went on in this country before and during the Civil Rights movement.
It was a stupid insensitive ignant thing to say.
here we go again.....
I'm outta this discussion. I've had my say. Next!
ya me too..like im gonna stick around to argue about a damn word that was here before and after racism.
im off to burn books and witch hunt see ya!
Bah.
I don't think Kelly has to be fired because other people have been fired in the past.
The stupidity of all those other people being fired in the past has finally caught up with everyone who is sick of choking on political correctness, and the time for this type of hypocritical righteous indignation is about over.
She said something funny that backfired because she chose the wrong words ... one would assume spontaneously ... and since the offendee isn't offended, the rest of us really should just mind our own business.
Sister please. This is the same Tracee I just read about in some old comments, the one who thinks Wiki is the shit and Brighton UK is a wilderness area.
Um, guys. Have you heard the latest? Kelly was just suspended for two weeks. Here's the link from the golf channel.
http://www.golf.com/golf/tours_news/article/0,28136,1701417,00.html
I guess that settles that.
I knew Kelly at Duke, and she was a black cock slut. You could not call her a racist. She fucked the entire basketball team! She's probably fucked Tiger too! So leave her alone already.
The bigger news is Hillary munching carpet. Not going to play well in Omaha.
^ So what, making racist comments and sucking off entire teams of dudes WOULD go down well in Omaha. Is that your point?
I'd still vote Hillary any day.
Christ, if this commentator had been a man she'd have been fired.
Yes Uber...she probably would have been fired if she were a man.
The Golf Channel had to discipline Kelly in some form....the network received thousands of complaints.
I don't think she said it in an overt racist manner, but she WAS ignorant and should have been more smart and "culturally aware." She is a PROFESSIONAL broadcaster and should act accordingly.
She could have used *other* words and phrasing which did NOT connect a black person with lynching in dark alleys. Had she made a comparable statement about a different ethnic group and methods used to exterminate them, she'd have been fired on the spot.
That her "apology" was conditional as to those who "may have" been offended? Almost as bad as the original comment. Her comments were offensive to all people of common decency, period. I'm glad she was suspended. I'm assuming she'll never get another interview with Woods or anyone else his staff represent.
Tracee,
I appreciate your comments on my post, as always. But although Jesus Christ and Joan of Arc are not "groups of people" they were certainly PART of a large group of people with a long history of being "lynched" and/or persecuted-called CHRISTIANS.
People are WAY too touchy. I am Catholic and I have to listen to Catholic bashing all of the time. People who jokingly say they are a "recovering Catholic" or make crude references to priests as if they are all child molesters, etc...If I got offended each and every time someone made an offhand remark about my faith, I'd be extremely miserable.
As a Christian, I believe in forgiveness. If someone does something wrong, they apologize and are sorry, you give them the benefit of the doubt and move on. You don't HAVE to collect your pound of flesh before you leave. When you fail to forgive, it truly says more about you that it ever could about the other person.
IMO
This just in-
Joy Behar suggests that saints were crazy and were hearing voices, which could have been helped by modern medicine. This is clearly a blast against the Catholic faith and I find it offensive. Anyone here think she will be suspended or fired? I don't think so....
BTW-nor do I think she should-while I find it offensive, she is on a show called the "View" and is expected to state her view. I don't watch the show anyway, so it doesn't make too much of a difference to me...
IMO
Between 1882 (when reliable statistics were first collected) and 1968, 4,743 persons died of lynching, 3,446 of them black men and women. Mississippi (539 black victims, 42 white) led this grim parade of death, followed by Georgia (492, 39), Texas (352, 141), Louisiana (335, 56), and Alabama (299, 48). From 1882 to 1901, the annual number nationally usually exceeded 100; 1892 had a record 230 deaths (161 black, 69 white).
Yes, the comment was made ignorantly, and was ignorant. However, what she was ignorant of was job training.
There is a list of Words for Which You Will Be Fired If You Use Them. Usually these words are referred to by the first initial (the N word, the C word....) Now we have the L word (and it doesn't mean Lesbian).
The bigger point of this discussion that I see missing is the probability that this list of words will become The List of Words That You Will Be Jailed For If You Use Them.
NotaHen, that was me! Hee! I never claimed I knew geography well. I glad my guffaw made a impression on you. [shrug]
Ice Angel,
I hear you. People are touchy, but that's what makes us human, our ability to emotionally connect to words.
Everybody has been offended by words, but I think its fair for people that have been offended to say so. Although...I don't think every offense should have a consequence. Shite, I don't even think Imus should've lost his job. 've heard worse on the radio. But I do commend the advertisers that pulled their commercials. It shows the character of a brand.
Ugh, I tired of talking about this subject. Moving on to other scandalous going-ons in ho-town, USA.
Wow, this got pretty out of hand. When I was growing up in Mexico I had great admiration for the US because people were able to say what they wanted without getting killed as was the case in Mexico, but it seems that some time in the late 80's (I came here in 89) and early 90's this PC stuff started to take off and the shit hit the fan. People are not getting killed, that I know of, but they get fired! FIRED! for saying what they think even if to some people it's offensive. If you live your life being offended for what is said about your race and others then I feel sorry for you. Mexicans are not the only immigrants in this country, in fact, everyone except the Indians are immigrants, and some states like California, Texas and New Mexico, used to be part of Mexico, so that would rule us out as immigrants, but it doesn't. If any of you have Turner Classic Movies or AMC and watch the really old cowboy movies you will see that when some old cowboy killed someone or someone's cattle the sheriff had to stop the "lynching party" from getting to him before a trial. And these cowboys were NOT black! Everybody makes fun of everybody, blacks make maxican jokes, white jokes, jewish jokes and it's ok, it's been done for ever. And last but not least, mexicans were also slaves untill we stopped it, got over it and moved on. (BTW, mexicans are the result of a mix between the spanish and the indians) So can't we all just get along???
ps. who is the most popular person in a mexican party?
The guy with the jumper cables....
what's sick is that golf is so racist that I just responded to the poll and over 60% of respondents say it's no big deal :(
While dining at Roy's in Pebble Beach we saw Fuzzy on the patio. Although there were some big golf fans, and he was a champ (before Tiger), no one wanted to shake his hand or get photos. Racists are ignorant and pathetic, but I still can't stomach enough sympathy to associate with them (and neither could anyone in our party).
You might remember his "fried chicken and collard greens comment" -- in case the name didn't ring a bell
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