Monday, July 23, 2012

Penn State Fined $60M - No Bowls For 4 Years


Some people thought that if any football program deserved the death penalty it would be Penn State. Apparently though giving money to student athletes is the only way you can do that while molesting a bunch of kids costs you a fine and four years of missed bowl games they probably would not make anyway. The NCAA ordered Penn State to pay $60M in fines and barred them from appearing in any bowl games for the next four years.


The one big thing that it did was that it vacated every win that Penn State received from 1998 to 2011. You might say to yourself what is the big deal about something that happened 11 years ago and how no one remembers how many games a team won anyway. The thing is that it knocked Joe Paterno from the football coach with the most wins. This weekend, Penn State also removed the Joe Paterno statue that had been on the campus.

126 comments:

N Squared said...

Correction: It dropped Paterno from first place to 12..

Cathy said...

Where does the 60 million dollars go? I hope that it goes to the victims, rather than the NCAA. While Penn State should have to pay, I don't think that the NCAA should profit financially from this.

Jennifer said...

Oh, and all the football players are free to transfer and eligible to start playing at any other school immediately. Talk about a recruiting bonanza. There will be no remaining team.

Ms Cool said...

It also punished the winning football players that had nothing to do with this atrocity.

Nichole Fisher said...

@Cathy - the 60 million goes into an endowed fund for children's charities and cannot be used by Penn State to settle with those abused by Sandusky

Amber said...

The $60M has to benefit external sexual abuse programs - they are NOT allowed to put it toward anything that is affiliated with Penn State.

a non a miss said...

This topic has caused so many heated arguments at work and home since I'm the only one who does not worship at the altar of JoePa. I'm glad they decided not to punish the students who did nothing, by killing the program for 2 years. But what JoePa didn't do, was wrong. He knew ALL about it and chose the prestige of PSU over innocent children. I'm glad his statue is gone. I hope all those fuckers who knowingly covered up for Sandusky all get what they deserve. Grrrr, I almost yelled at my boss (who knew someone who used to coach there so of course she knows everything) cause she defended JoePa! There's NO defending him.

Amber said...

A recruit has already decommitted this morning.

Amber said...

Someone on my FB said it best, "If what the NCAA is doing to Penn State bothers you, just look the other way and pretend nothing's happening."

Think about it for a sec.

figgy said...

I just wish Joe Paterno were still alive to see himself fully shamed. I'm just glad he lived long enough to be aware of what was coming, and to know that he would go down in infamy rather than glory.

I'm sure many would think I'm too harsh, but no. He let more boys be victimized in order to further his own career. What could be more, literally, devilish, than that?

Pookie said...

while i applaud the NCAA for the fines...those sanctions are not nearly enough. :(

a uni hierarchy enabled and covered up child molestation--and STILL the most punished are the student athletes. #wthiswrongwithyouPennState

Anonymous said...

Championship banners are hung in front of big crowds, they are taken down with nobody around in the middle of the night. Vacating wins is pointless imo.

figgy said...

@Amber, perfect. May I steal it?

Karen said...

@Amber, NICE.

I hate all the excuses made for Joe Paterno. It reminds me of all the actors who defend Roman Polanski.

Amber said...

Sure, as long as you say it came from a random on facebook :)

EmEyeKay said...

Yes Amber, me too?

Ms Cool said...

While I feel sad for the innocent students (and of course my heart weeps for the victims), I do want to follow up on what I said above and say that I really wish the real wrongdoers will see their day. I do like this punishment.

I'd also like to see what happened to the grand jury prosecutor that disappeared. I think there is way more evil than what we have already heard here.

I also really like what Amber's friend said.

cheesegrater15 said...

Would like to see the football program ended completely.

Somebody on NBC Nightly News still defended Paterno. "They're using him as a scapegoat." SMDH

Kaizer... said...

It may not be a direct hit, but this will destroy their football program.

Maybe the next coversation should be about how much power and $$$ these coaches have. Its not just a Penn State problem.

MISCH said...

And what about that big payout Paterno's family got ?

Amber said...

Vicki, did that person say whether or not they were a PSU Alum?

minerpoteet said...

Penn State students, athletes, faculty and alumni benefited when there are awards and money and prestige heaped on them for what the football team and Paterno did. Now they can share in the shame of what the people in power at Penn State,including Paterno didn't do. Like you say. You are Penn State.

surfer said...

Can someone please explain something to me?

If the whole point is to win games in order to be eligible for the bowl games, what's the point in allowing the team to play/exist at all, if they are not allowed to go to the bowl(s)? Or is it because the NCAA doesn't have the power to shut down a school's football program?

Ms Cool said...

@Amber - just posted your friend's comment on Facebook, giving the credit you asked for.

a non a miss said...

A lot of my family members and a few friends are PSU alums, and its so sad how they still defend JoePa, its like a cult up there. I'm telling you, they worship JoePa, and will viciously attack anyone who speaks out against him or the school.

Amber said...

surfer, part of it is that it screws things up for the rest of the conference. Other schools in the Big 10, etc, wouldn't have a full schedule and all that. Then I imagine it hurts their $$$ because they aren't televised, yadda yadda.

surfer said...

Thanks Amber - I know absolutely nothing about college football.

Amber said...

Ms Cool - awesome! It was too profound/succinct/accurate/smart not to spread.

Amber said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
cheesegrater15 said...

Amber it was some random person they used for a soundbite.

discoflux said...

@surfer - I have no real knowledge about it but my guess would be to allow the current recruits to at least showcase their skills and play out their scholarships. IMO, the fines are substantial enough, and I like no bowl games for 4 years. I also think that gives sufficient time for the program to be dismantled via recruits bowing out. No one is going to want to play for what essentially amounts to a recreational league team for the next 4 years. And they are now only allowed 15 football scholarships instead of 25 so recruiting will be even more difficult. It's going to be an interesting progression to watch and it's going to take a LONG time for PSU to rebuild after this.

But, all in all, it's too little, too late.

Sarah said...

Great quote, Amber.

I definitely feel like the players are collateral damage, and I'm hoping their careers don't suffer greatly as a result.

As far as the program goes, they have the money, JoePa was flying around on private jets. This will kill their role as power players t bough. End of an era.

TV Junkie said...

Whoa, minerpoteet! I am a Penn State alum who is on the 30-year student loan payment plan. It is unfair to demonize all of us. I worked hard and am proud of my Penn State education, even though I find this situation disgusting all around.

Amber said...

Here, if you guys want to use this go ahead. I just posted it on my Tumblr. http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7mdnwyNe71qfh71mo1_500.jpg

TV Junkie said...

Also, I have never once defended JoePa. I know the difference between right and wrong. I only wish he had realized that if he did the right thing he could have been a hero rather than a disgraced coach. He deserves to be disgraced for letting this happen. It's a shame that people put money and accolades ahead of physical and emotional health & safety.

EmEyeKay said...

Seattle-ites: JP Patches is dead. :(

Bleu said...

Fine, whatever. When has anyone ever done anything like this for little girls or women who've been raped? Oh yeah, never, but freak the fuck out and go to town and for the first time in their lives get political and actually come down with something that will hurt the perpetrators if it's boys.

surfer said...

Thanks discoflux. Your answer makes a lot of sense.

Cathy said...

@nichole and amber - thanks! work is so crazy today that i haven't had a chance to read any full articles on it, but i knew readers here would know the answer!

Jennifer H. said...

I live that! It's perfect. I will probably say that to someone the next time I find myself in a discussion.

Brenda L said...

I smell the scent of a major tuition hike.

timebob said...

I only wish JoPa was around to see his whole world crumble and be charged for his crimes of protecting Sandusky and choosing the football program over innocence.

I think it is fair what they did. According to TMZ they considered the death penalty but thought this would have an overall deeper impact.

Penn State is the most expensive state school there is. I can't see how people are going to pay such high costs to go to school there after all this.

Cathy said...

@Amy - all types of rape and sexual abuse are terrible and inexcusable, but off the top of my head, I can't think of any similar situations where so many girls were raped by the same man and a public institution knowingly covered it up for years. If there's a situation you can think of, I'd be curious to hear it.

A friend of mine is a lawyer and most of her cases are pretty boring (financial planning stuff), but she has one client who is a woman in prison for murder. It turns out that she and many other female inmates were repeatedly gang raped by guards for many years. They filed a class-action lawsuit against the prison and they are now all millionaires (though they can't touch the money while they're in jail, hence why she needed my friend to help her invest it).

Trey said...

timebomb, totally agree with you. Wish Paterno was around to see what his legacy has become. Considering he played the martyr up until the end, knowing what he'd done, he deserves this.

I hope the victims receive millions in damages.

EmEyeKay said...

@Cathy - was this public knowledge? In the news?

CantHaveMyPurse said...

Without calling this a 'death penalty', it is essentially a death penalty (which is fine with me). Four years of no bowls, no tv time, 20 less scholarships a year is a BIG deal to this organization and will cripple it for a least a decade. I'm fine with it all. I'd have been fine with a death penalty as well. I think after the SMU death penalty, the NCAA has been hesitant to go that far, but right up to the edge of it.


JoePa is no hero. He knew what was going on and not only did nothing to stop it, he actively made sure it was never discovered. He covered it up. The fact that people in PSU cannot come to terms with that shows how deeply in denial they are. Scape goat? Hardly. Culpable participant, more likely.

PSU is no irrelevant in the world of college football. And for all the damage the coaches/president/etc have done, I think it ought to be.

Next up: Loads of money paid out to the victims. Wait to see what happens there. It'll be interesting and I expect they are already talking terms with the known victims.

minerpoteet said...

@TV Junkie You're right. There are hundreds/thousands of former and current Penn Staters that are thoroughly disgusted by the actions of Sandusky and his enablers. I've seen and heard some of them and their thoughts. When you see people still defending Paterno or rallying to save his statue or his reputation. It's hard not to tar the whole school with the same brush. I still think the punishment handed down was just. But I get your point.

TV Junkie said...

Just to be clear, I completely agree with the punishment as well. I wouldn't mind seeing a harsher punishment. It's just a shame that the people who brought the punishment on the school won't be the ones having to deal with the ramifications and trying to rebuild. I speak only of the sanctions here - not the legal punishments and public disgrace for Sandusky & his enablers.

michelelala said...

Let us hope that the sanctions while not directly affecting those who were involved, send a message that any kind of institutional cover-up will not be tolerated anywhere.

As for the Penn St folks that are ashamed, let them prove that they are better than the few that tarnished their school. Penn State will recover.

Little Miss Smoke and Mirrors said...

ENTy, it may have been stated above, but you missed the part about all the lost scholarships the school will suffer for 4 years going forward. That will basically destroy the football program for 10 years. It's actually an ingenious punishment. I was all for death penalty until my brother (who works in sports) explained to me how these sanctions are actually worse.

Vacating the victories is such a perfect karmic stroke of genius. It directly addresses the Penn State culture of "football first" and shits all over them. If Jay Paterno is smart, he will keep his piehole firmly closed going forward.

SusanB said...

I've been following the stories today and I've heard one reason Penn didn't get the death penalty is that the local townspeople like stores and restaurant owners really depend on income made on game days as a large proportion of their yearly income and didn't want to penalize them. I've also seen a few commenters on different sites say that some of the players knew about it through 3rd hand gossip. That'll probably never be proven. I'm just glad the NCAA isn't penalizing the current and new players so that they can transfer to other institutions if they so desire without taking the usual one year off. I've also heard they can take their scholarships with them, but I'm not sure about that.

And the Paterno family just needs to shut the fuck up.

dia papaya said...

JUSTICE!

Not really, right? Because a few people didn't do the right thing when they had a chance thousands of people are negatively effected. Its not just the football team. What about employees who will lose work? Current and potential students who mau not be able to afford school now? The ripple effect will be huge!

JoePa is just another cult leader in more respectable clothing. I wish he was alive to see it crumble now and truly apologize for what he did.

@carebear - I like your fiesty spirit! I have lots of PA relatives and I know how hard it is to take a stand against JoePa.

Tru Leigh said...

My biggest beef with this ruling is the $60 Million fine is goingto victims of sexual abuse.

How about using the money to prevent the abuse in the first place?

dia papaya said...

As someone who knows nothing about football, can someone explain the importance of vacating victories and why 1998 was do important.

I can't be the only football dummy on here.

a non a miss said...

Thank you dia!! All my aunts and uncles went to PSU and I was shamed when I decided to not go there, Im happy with my decision tho. Ive never liked PSU, I'm more of a Pitt girl myself!

SusanB said...

@Truleigh - it's not going to the victims - it's going to exactly what you want - programs to prevent abuse.

As for the football program, they really need to clean house from top to bottom - everyone from the coaches through the secretaries and even the janitors. They all knew, or heard the gossip. We've all worked in offices, etc, where everything is gossiped about. You have to know that there was a lot of suspicion, and a few phone calls, even if made anonymously, could have stopped it back in 1998.
Paterno could have pushed it in 1998 - it might have slightly affected his program that year, but I doubt it, and he would have set an example to the college world on how to behave. His legend would have been even brighter than it was a year ago. We can only hope that other athletic programs who have this problem (and you know they're out there) are watching this and deciding to clean up their acts.

Little Miss Smoke and Mirrors said...

@dia papaya - Vacating the victories is largely symbolic. As for 1998, that is the year of the first *known* (proven) abuse of children by Jerry Sandusky began. It probably began before that, but so far no one has come forward alleging they were abused before that year.

Penn State has had a "football first" culture for much of the 61 years Joe Paterno had coached there. Vacating the victories not only affects "beloved" Paterno's record of "most winning football coach in history" (he drops from #1 to #12), it sends a message to the entire Penn State community, and to any other school as well, that football is NOT first. You can't put football ahead of law-abiding citizenship and decency and a basic moral code.

Little Miss Smoke and Mirrors said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
discoflux said...

Dia - It's more of a symbolic gesture to strip the school of its football legacy.

surfer said...

Dia - you're not! I believe (and correct me if I'm wrong) that 1998 was the first reported incident of rape, and because Joe Paterno knew about it (and did nothing), they are penalizing him by wiping out his win record.

Was that a good explanation?

anita_mark said...

@Amber, can I just say how awesome I think you are for crediting the quote to someone else. We'd never know but you would. I like that in a person although you can feel free to not care ;)

College football is fascinating to me (not really). People really do live and die over it.

M said...

I'm not sure if anyone answered this, but the $60 million is going to prevention programs. I just received an email about it from the President of PSU.

I graduated from Penn State, and I'm still proud. Penn State gave me an amazing education.

JoePa messed up bad. However, everyone is scapegoating him. Let's not forget about Sandusky?

Also, the NCAA sanctions hurt the students more than anyone. Everyone who is responsible for what happened is no longer with the University.

Amber said...

@ anita_mark - Oh, thank you! It would never sit right with me to take credit for something I didn't do. My guilt-complex is out of control! :)

dia papaya said...

Thanks Little Miss Smoke and Disco!

Great point SusanB. Anyone could have made the call. Sadly, I wonder if the police or whoever would have listened.

yawnathon said...

Excellent point.

Leah said...

My older son played an NCAA Div I sport in college (not Penn State), and so we learned the ins and outs of the NCAA rules. The fact that the NCAA is letting the players transfer to any school - including those within their conference - without any lag in playtime, is HUGE. Add to that, any player who wants to quit can keep their sports scholarship while continuing to study at PS. Say goodbye to your football program for years and years to come, Penn State.

missmade said...

I'm no JoePa fan, but I live and work in Happy Valley. My friends work here. The community economy is based around the school and football traffic.

For those bitching about retribution and reveling the punishment: NO ONE WINS. A mother of one of the victims said that the night of Sandusky's verdict, a sentiment I shared as I stood on the courthouse lawn looking at the circus my little town had become.

YOU MIGHT NOT KNOW THIS: but the majority of high ranking football employees circa 98-11 have been fired. Rightly so.

But do me a favor before you burn this program in effigy (and JoePa as well). Think of this:
- There are 40+ other sports programs here that benefit immensely from football tix sales (including women's soccer, tennis, etc)

- Honest and good people work at PSU. They work at the delis and grocery stores that feed them. They abound here and they donate money & time to charities. We are innocent in this and our economy will be affected greatly.

- JoePa donated more money than you ever will to higher education. Doesn't excuse his role in the cover up, but still, he was capable of greatness.

BEFORE you react with a dance, or high five yourself because Penn State has been punished, think about the good people here. We are sad and not just because their will be no bowl games.

missmade said...

BTW, the District Attorney went missing - not the head of the grand jury. He most likely killed himself - something which was not uncommon in his family - and it has nothing to do with this.

No offense, but if you are dancing on our grave, I kind of think you are a dick.

pilly said...

I was watching as the statue was removed and I couldn't help but think of Paterno's kid(s). What they must be feeling. So proud of dad and then the Sandusky arrest, firing, cancer and then death. I wonder if they have come to grips with it all. I'm not saying I agree with what he did He should have spoken up LOUDLY. I was just thinking about how a kid looks up to Dad w some form of admiration and safety (if that makes sense to anyone but me)

M said...

http://rainn.org/ProudPSUforRAINN

M said...

@missmade

Thank you. It couldn't have been said any better.

Del Riser said...

@EmEyekay, thank you for the news on J.P.Patches. Another chunk of childhood. : (

Salsa Lover said...

So who will be the won to stand up for all the girls getting molested and taking advantage of in Hollywood? We have this for these poor boys. And yet we read daily about how girls in Hollywood are taken advantage of and Enty doesn't report it? Are they true? Can there not be anonymous tips?

I think the punishment is good but I would have preferred a bigger fine. I can see the apologists donating money now to cover that. The whole thing is sickening. I just wish that there was something that could be done for the girls we read about daily on here. Does no one know? Does no one want to bring them down too?

Little Miss Smoke and Mirrors said...

@missmaid Tell it to the Paterno family, Spanier, Dottie Sandusky, etc. Complain to those who put you in this position, not to the rest of us who see the clear justification for this punishment. The community prospered and thrived off Penn State's crimes, so that it now suffers elicits zero sympathy. Your tears are meaningless compared to the silent tears that were shed by the victims of your community's abuse and silence.

Texshan said...

Well, I wrote it on my FB page this morning, and I believe it: the NCAA is more upset by financial misdeeds than it is by a widespread lack of common human decency. It's ridiculous that SMU got the death penalty, but not Penn State.

The said...

I wonder when the Catholic Church will own up to its responsibilities, up to & including Herr Pope.

pilly said...

I'm a Patches Pal.

What happened?!?!!!!?!?

WHAT HAPPENED???!!!!

Texshan said...

M, what about Mike McQueery, whio actually WITNESSED the abuse and kept quiet in exchange for a coaching job? He's still there.

Paterno was NOT a scapegoat. That dude's shit didn't stink in Happy Valley. He could have blown the whistle on Sandusky and not suffered one bit for it. He chose not to. He chose to aid and abet the cover-up. He chose to continue to let children be molested. He chose to let Sandusky continue to run his children's program. The guy was a dick.

And missmade, yeah, Paterno donated a lot of money to charity. But he also MADE a lot of money. It's not like he was making $50k a year and donating half of it. So please don't try to paint him as some kind of Father Christmas.

CantHaveMyPurse said...

@Texshan - you are EXACTLY right. That's why you didn't see the death penalty here, and I doubt we ever will again.

But, these sanctions are pretty steep. Someone likened it to 'not a death penalty, but life in prison'. PSU is hosed for many many years, even w/out receiving the death penalty.

anita_mark said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
anita_mark said...

@missmade, put the blame where the blame belongs.

NomNom83 said...

Last I checked, the NCAA is not a legal authority. I don't disagree with the hammer they just brought down on PSU, but this just doesn't feel like "justice" to me. Just desserts, maybe, to a certain extent, but not legal justice.

Yeah, Paterno is dead and his legacy has been rightfully destroyed. So what? What about EVERYONE ELSE who *knew* and swept it under the rug. You've got an eyewitness saying a little boy is getting sodomized in your showers and your solution is to not let kids from the program come on campus anymore?! That is criminal in its negligence and any DA with two brain cells should be able to find some law, somewhere, to pin on everyone who washed their hands when they should have been firing Sandusky and turning him over to the cops.

Athena said...

First let me say, of course I feel for the victims and their families and anyone associated with this cowardly sicko. Sandusky deserves what he's in for.

For those who say secretaries and janitors should be removed as well for hearing and passing on rumors, what does that say for all of us who have been told repeatedly that Nickelodeon BMOC Dan Schneider is a habitual child raper (yes, in my book, manipulating underage children for sex is rape) and that Viacom covers it up? Is it our duty to pass something along we read heard as gossip? Could we be saving one more child from feeling like shit about themselves for the rest of their lives or would we be damaging an innocent man's career for good?

Just think about it before you pass judgement on the whole lot, please.

M said...

You're right, I forgot about McQueery. Trust me, all PSU alumni are furious that he's received no punishment.

And this isn't directed towards any one person, but if you didn't go to PSU, don't pretend to know what we believe. We are all very upset also and disgusted.

TV Junkie said...

Thanks, M. It's nice to hear someone else who's in the same situation say it!

Trey said...

M, I don't think all of PSU believe or feel one thing. There are many people disgusted, there are also many people (current students and alum) still defending Paterno.

0_0 said...

Vacating previous wins, okay, but any player who stays will be punished with the school.

The NCAA cannot hand out legal punishments. The other trustee members, etc., who covered up will hopefully get their day with the justice system.

Sadie said...

@Amber "If what the NCAA is doing to Penn State bothers you, just look the other way and pretend nothing's happening."

WOW - Just Wow!

EmEyeKay said...

Pilly, he died :(

missmade said...

@M I guess people don't understand unless you live year.

@Anita_Mark. Thanks for deleting the comment where you called me a dick. It was nice.

What I've learned from comments is that most of you haven't read MY local news, nor did you read the Freeh report. I have. I also have friends who are reporters.

FYI: McQuery is gone. He was put on leave and his contract was ended. He did the best he could.

The cops that investigated in 98 found things that interested them, but they could go no further because of the DA. A social worker at the time noted nothing wrong. People did their jobs in 98 and it wasn't enough.

I actually FEEL sadness and care about the kids. I've donated time and money to local charities, including the Second Mile, so if you don't think my heart is with those kids, you're wrong. I care that my money could have gone to hurting those kids.

I watched them daily from my home as they walked into testify.

Do I want your sympathy? No, I could give a shit.

But seriously, for someone to say "Spare me your tears…" Do you have any idea how life works in a college town? People here are not in a conspiracy. Not everyone here cares about football. Millions of kids, students, adults live here.

What will those of you angry about this to better your community? Other than rail comments on the internet.

missmade said...

BTW, I thought Joe should have retired a half dozen years ago. He let his players get away with everything, including assault.

I don't disagree that his statue was removed or that he was fired. That is appropriate and a good idea.

I'm super happy that Graham Spanier was fired.

But Penn State didn't rape any kids.

A guy named Sandusky who was retired from PSU did. HE WAS RETIRED.

Jodell24 said...

I could not agree with you more Cathy! Give the poor victims the money! Why should the NCAA get it?

missmade said...

The $60 million fine will be paid over 4 years and go directly to children's charities.

Jennifer H. said...

Joe Paterno is not being scapegoated. In no way was that man a victim in any of this. He knew children were being sexually abused and he didn't do what he reasonably and decently should have done to stop it. That is evil.

I know Paterno's family was probably blindsided by this and are among the peripheral innocent victims, but they need to shut their mouths. Maybe it's a Paterno trait to not know when to speak up or when to pipe down?

Brooke said...

First time poster, short time lurker. Also stealing Amber's quote - LOVE IT! I have in-laws who, when the scandal came about, tried to say that Joe Pa was just a scapegoat. Since it was Christmas, I just shut my mouth and let the ignorance fly - some of them are from PA, and I was outnumbered. I'm hoping their opinions have changed since then, y'know, since it's proven that he knew *exactly* what was going on.

0_0 said...

missmade, Penn State stayed affiliated with Sandusky through facilites use, etc., and actively covered for him. Either would make them liable.

Mango said...

I read the same quote about "looking the other way" when Joe Paterno's statue was taken down.

Fitting in both instances.

SusanB said...

To those above who went to/live near/work at Penn State - I KNOW Penn State is a good school otherwise. Several of my cousins graduated from Penn State. The best analogy I've heard (and as a Catholic, this pains me more than you know) is that Paterno and the administrators that looked the other way are no better than the bishops who looked the other way at the pedophile priests. Still, even though, as a Catholic, I knew nothing of this abuse, and don't know anyone who was abused (my brother and all my male cousins were altar boys and all swear it never happened to them) I still pay the price by some of the money I put in the collection plate going to pay reparations (deserverdly) to the victims, or the slurs I've heard about Catholicism. Unfortunately, Penn State is in the same situation right now. It will recover, but it's going to take a long time.,

Brooke said...

+1

Shallow Gal said...

I do feel bad for the players that are really going to get screwed about something that happened when they were in kindergarten...Most of these kids worked their whole lives to get recruited by a D1 team and they are going to be punished as well. Guilt by association and in this circumstance I understand why that needs to be...I went through the college recruiting process with my son...something we all started working on when he was in jr. hi. It's a lifetime thing and I think it would be crushing to take the program away completely from them. Having said that, I would never want my son to play for Penn State. This could be the eventual death of the football program...surely recruiting is severely damaged. I can't imagine who will want to go play there.

Texshan said...

MissMade, Mike McQueary did NOT do "the best that he could." Any normal, decent person, upon seeing a child being sexually abused, would end the abuse IMMEDIATELY and call the cops. I can't believe that you think McQueary did everything he could possibly do. He did nothing, in exchange for a coaching job.

And yes, Sandusky was retired. But only AFTER he started molesting children and the brass found out about it. He retired with an unusually generous compensation package, a lump-sum payment of $168k, and a designation of "emeritus," which allowed him to continue to use university facilities to rape children. All of the brass knew about it and let it continue. They didn't restrict him from the buildings until last November!

Butterfly said...

May these children's healing trajectories be a but easier knowing that though it took a while, evil was discovered and punished. May they also know that we as a society care about them and will stand by them as they heal.

To those victims, I say this: We understand that you have nightmares and are frightened, and can no longer trust people. We understand that because of the terrible actions of Sandusky, Penn State, and countless other adults, your eyes have been opened to only the dark places and you can no longer see light from where you are. May you heal and be able to see that there are good people too, people who care about you. We stand with you.

-Butterfly
www.reasonsyoushouldntfuckkids.wordpress.com

SkittleKitty said...

Obviously, my first sympathies are to the abuse victims and I have very little sympathy for the school because there was clearly an atmosphere that promoted football above all else. (The little bit of sympathy goes out to the departments/sports that had no knowledge or connection but will suffer as a result.)

Having said that, I feel a bit for @missmaid and anyone who lives in that area. Football is a HUGE economic driver of that town and it will hurt EVERYONE in State College, regardless of association with the school, Paterno, Sandusky, etc.

I do not feel the punishment was too much but I think the so-called 'death penalty' could actually have led to near-destruction of the school and/or town. As it is, their economy/outlook is pretty grim for quite some time to come.

Frufra said...

@Texshan - ITA. Had the same conversation in our house. Guess as Texans we all remember the SMU death penalty.

trogdor said...

I think the punishment is fine. I do feel for the people in the town, but, honestly, bowl or no bowl, Penn State should still have sellout games. USC was banned and they still sold out games even after their top 12 recruits left.

The reason the fine goes all the way back to 1998 is to remove Joe Paterno's all-time wins. Takes
him from 1st to 12th

The ban from the bowls is because the school makes money from the bowl systems. In college football, there is no playoff system. The teams are ranked by a computer program which suggests the winningest team that particular year. Each year, the BCS (Bowl Championship Series) designates one of several bowl games as the title game. The top two schools in the computer ranking NOT their record ranking get to play in that title game. The rest of the bowls are to make money. Many schools that show up for the first time actually LOSE money because the AD's in the bowl charge outrages fees that put these programs in the red. Now a succesfull program, such as Penn that has been to the bowl so many times, that their fees are much, much lower to the point where they come out in the black. This is why proponents of a playoff structure are so adament about needing a change. The NCAA and the AD's can make millions from these bowls, while the programs playing can actually lose money. The proponents of the BCS don't really have a counter-argument other than they feel it works. It is no coincedence that many of the AD's are former NCAA emoyees. The NCAA is basically killing the program from making any significant money the next four years. That will hurt everything from funding to recruiting and substantially affect the program. It will recover in about 8-10 years. College football has more income and spending than most pro leagues COMBINED.

M said...

Trogdor -- you're right. There will still be white outs.

Popnursing said...

@Tru - Helping those who have been victimized is an extremely important part of preventing future abuse.

@Amy - You make an interesting point, but sadly I think the outrage had more to do with football rather than the gender of the victims.

M said...

Actually, I wonder if they will be blue outs from now on.

__-__=__ said...

The artist of that statue needs to demand that it is melted down. That needs to go.

trogdor said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
trogdor said...

Correction: It looks at though they did institute a play-off system until 2025. Four teams. Not bad, never thought it would happen. Looks like it kicks off in 2015. Which is three years away. I'm thinking Penn State didn't get hit that hard, then.

Great article on the playoff system

Those that are worried the town around Penn State will collapse:

Great write up by Forbe on why the NCAA really did nothing to Penn State

HolidayinCambodia said...

Well, I'm a Penn State alumnus, and I am ashamed, but not surprised, at the conspiracy and cover up. The death penalty would have been just fine with me.

surfer said...

To those that live in or around State College, I'd be interested to know how people are responding to Dottie Sandusky - is she being treated as a pariah, or are people rallying around her?

Probably a bit of both.

M said...

I think people are still assuming that PSU is on the side of Sandusky.

We are not.

Priscilla said...

I never have understood, probably as a non sports fan, how sports got so big and all powerful at US universities. I know it is supposed to be a big $ maker,but seems to me the institution would be better off without it. But that's just me.

0_0 said...

Priscilla- of course money is part of it, but at some more marginal schools there isn't a net gain (UC's money from the 1990 Copper Bowl was blown on, for instance, flying Coach Snyder's wife and others to the game).

A successful program is something that the school, much of the surrounding area, and alumni take a lot of pride in. My home town (left unnamed) had a rapid population growth after a new coach restarted a long winning tradition; the older part of town is mostly untouched.

A side effect is that, despite denials, the smaller the host city/ town, the more influence the school has there. Coach McQueary went to a top authority with what he saw and going to the police would've accomplished the same nothing. He could have stopped Sandusky with that vistim, and he could've gone to the media- especially to a rival's hometown news, or a national- but he would've lost his job and been out of serious football. To paraphrase Chris Rock, I don't agree with his choice- but I understand.

El Roy 13 said...

Now the Penn State pres is saying he was beaten as a child.....boo hoo (b/c somehow, I don't believe it)

http://www.lehighvalleylive.com/breaking-news/index.ssf/2012/07/former_penn_state_president_gr_1.html

Lelaina Pierce said...

I got to listen to sports radio (yay me)on the way home from TN today, so I heard a whole lot of commentary on this.

@missmade, I feel you on what you are saying about the innocent employees/students/community, etc.

But to say McQueary did all he could?? o_O

I just had this same conversation with all my friends this weekend and each of us said we would have launched on that bastard and done everything we could to help that kid. Even if it meant losing my job. And truth be told, I wouldn't have wanted to be affiliated with anything PSU related if I knew even an INKLING of what was really going on.

I agree the punishment doesn't quite seem harsh enough for decades of abuse but to be honest, I was actually surprised they went as far as they did.

I forgot about SMU and my husband was also wondering how this particular verdict is going to affect Miami's program. Recruiting violations, paying players, etc. seems like normal activity in college football compared to raping children.

I also want to know about how people are treating the rest of the Paternos and Sandusky's family??

Cannot believe I just wrote that much about college football.

Eeekalicious said...

As usual, the athletes get punished.

doctressjulia said...

Girls are raped by serial rapists every day. The majority of child victims of pedocriminals are girls.

h88p:// www.cpiu.us/ statistics-2/

"All but 3% of offenders who committed violent crimes against children were male."

"3 in 4 child victims of violence were female."

But, see, according to our female-hating culture, girls aren't 'raped', they're 'sexually assaulted'. And, nobody really cares; par for the rape culture course and all that. That's what girls and women exist for: to be raped by boys and men. Ho hum, how mundane. Erased.

But, boys are special snowflakes so it's more important when they are raped. The OUTRAGE! See, it "challenges their masculinity" to be raped. In other words, it makes them less of a man. Who are lesser than men? Girls and women are. That has been made quite clear to me, for as long as I can remember. The first time a man tried to rape me, I was 11. It changed EVERYTHING. Forever.

doctressjulia said...

Oh, NO! Won't SOMEONE think of the poor, poor athletes? /s

They should just shut this school down. End it. NO MORE FUNDING. Nothing. The school will be haunted forever by what these men have done. So many lives ruined. I hate organized sports- it's just another toxic patriarchal institution. Bread and circuses.

Sandy said...

Sorry; those "good people" in Happy Valley were Paterno's (and for a while, Sandusky's) loudest apologists and defenders. A town in total service to a corrupt university athletic department can't complain when the hammer quite rightly comes down on them. A culture dedicated to protecting that institution, no matter how morally bankrupt and criminal it is, cannot cry foul when it is exposed and dismantled. You reap what you sow.

In my opinion this NCAA punishment isn't harsh enough.

doctressjulia said...

Let the victims come and burn it to the ground.

M said...

First, we didn't have all of the evidence. We supported JoePa because we didn't know. Now we do.

Second, are you seriously suggesting shutting down a world-class institution because of football? Get real.

missmade said...

@M: Word

@Sandy: You are misled. Maybe the loudest were Paterno apologists, but not all of us. MOST people here are sad, very sad. I only met one Sandusky apologist in person, on the night of the verdict, and he was a kid who went through the Second Mile.

People here are sad and angry. No one wins.

No one wins.

The million+ of us who live here don't all consort in a basement to connive ways to cover people we never met. We are not protecting anyone. I personally just want my friends who work all over PSU to be ok. They are librarians, graphic designers, asst professors, etc.

To say a whole school should be shuttered because of what one man did is short-sighted and you obviously know nothing about PSU. We are an AG school first and foremost. The school is surround by fields of cows. A professor was just received a huge grant for cancer research. The football team was just name tops in academics.

missmade said...

I've only a few friends who have spoken with either Paternos or Mrs. Sandusky. They don't know what to say or how to act. Mrs. Sandusky still believes her husband is innocent.

McQuery maybe could have done more. I don't know. I've never been 22 and walked in on a kid getting raped by a trusted coach.

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